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Good post by MikeB.
This message was posted from a K700i
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Posted: 2005-08-22 23:08:25
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iTunes/Apple uses FairPlay as its DRM packaging system, so the answer is NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!! iTunes purchased song will not play on any other device unless you can remove the FairPlay wrapper. Second, Apple now has included a Lossless codec, and still allows converting to .aiff. WMV has been shunned by many due to its inferior sound reproducing qualities initially. However MS may have made improvements, but for the most part a comparable .aac will sound better than an .mp3 or .wmv file.
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Posted: 2005-08-23 18:20:38
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I don't see why anyone has issues getting the music on the phone. Even if you hate disc2phone or if you want to use itunes to encode everything as m4a (which I do for space reasons
) its as simple as setting the MP3 folder on the memory stick then having itunes encode the music for you. This creates all the nessecary disk structure you need.
At least it is as easy as that on a PC. I couldn't say for mac users.
As for protected formats, theres also the issue of OMA which the mobile phone networks are persuing as well. I would expect this to be seen more in the phone first than either itunes or WMA protected formats. But I agree, lets blame the device for format wars after all, it's the devices fault for using open standards, something that traditionally Sony HAVEN'T done. Lets at least thank SE for going to more open standards at least.
Format wars between the players are going to be interesting, not at least legally where in some countries where you can purchase a cd and are allowed to make upto 2 copies (one for backup and 1 for a portable media player) for your own personal use - I wonder if this will extend to those services too.
There might also be the fact of liscensing, in which
might not want to pay either apple AND ms for use of their wrapped formats when perfectly good free alternatives exist.
Afaik isn't itunes designed for use with ipods anyhow? If I recall there's a complaint that other portable media player users are left out by it and have to transfer music manually as well. I don't see this as being any different?
I don't see a problem for non drm content, its just a matter of finding a media player with the right conversion features for you and what you find easy. For me its itunes at the moment, simply because I have the cd's at hand or the mp3s. Theres alot about itunes itself I don't like as far as managment software goes though.
For DRM content, well it'll have to be a wait and see thing, or find out what rights you have after you have purchased the song.
(OOPS, edit for MWA -> WMA... though MWA sounds much more friendly as a format acronym
)
[ This Message was edited by: Gigs on 2005-08-24 00:05 ]
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Posted: 2005-08-23 23:57:23
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Thanks Gigs and JoolsG4 for sanity in your posts.
The software that comes with the phone does not work on a Mac but we have the ability to access the file structure directly and we (Mac users), can create a small script to automate the conversion and importation of music on to the MS.
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Posted: 2005-08-24 00:46:12
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On 2005-08-22 16:57:01, JoolsG4 wrote:
I don't suppose you're a programmer, are you Simon? If so, I reckon you could make a few quid if you wrote exactly the program you're looking for!
LoL - no, not in my day job at least. Might have a look at this little task, as it is bugging me no end that SE hasn't provided software up to the job.
MikeB - great post.
max_wedge - thanks, I hadn't realised that I didn't need to maintain the folder structure. Does it pick up properly from the tagging to browse by artist, album etc if not in the folders?
If so, then this opens up a range of software that will work well - eg, MusicMatch jukebox. On your other points - I can't directly use drag and drop as my large music collection is ripped in lossless and/or high bitrate formats. Thus I need to alter bit rate to suit the device, or I can't get many tracks on - that is the nub of my problems, and that is the point that most respondents are missing. I want to transcode to a format and bitrate that the phone can handle directly from a library.
Lumps: I don't have a small library.
Gigs - when you say "it's as simple as setting the MP3 folder on the memory stick then having itunes encode the music for you." What do you mean exactly? You seem to recognize the problem later in your post "Afaik isn't itunes designed for use with ipods anyhow? If I recall there's a complaint that other portable media player users are left out by it and have to transfer music manually as well. I don't see this as being any different?". Other than for the process or ripping or converting whole folders and duplicating libraries, I haven't seen anyone show me how iTunes actually solves the problem I have with getting music onto the device. My source library is large. My phone is small. I need to transcode formats and bit rates, and I don't want duplicate libraries to maintain on the PC. iTunes won't help.
Sapporobaby. I very much hope that you aren't implying that there is insanity in the other posts. Can we keep the posting on a civil level please.
Simon
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Posted: 2005-08-24 19:15:31
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Sapporobaby. I very much hope that you aren't implying that there is insanity in the other posts. Can we keep the posting on a civil level please.
Simon
Just poking a stick.
Anyway, you are correct. iTunes is not for you unless you want to use it to encode your music. You can use the Lossless encoder. It makes smaller than .wav files but larger than a standard .mp3 or .aac. Maybe I am wrong but no one I know that has the choice would choose .wma as a codec for encoding due to the less than superior sound quality when compared to .mp3 and .aac. Soooo, if space is a premium your best bet would be to encode with .aac (better sound quality at a smaller file size), and then use the supplied softare that came with the phone to transfer them to the phone. You might also consider trans-coding your files to .acc as the .mp3 standard is old and on the way out anyway.
P.S. There is one more time consuming and pain in the but way to do things. Get Music Match. Trans-code from everything into .wav, then trans-code into .acc and thus have one final library.
_________________
"Einstein was right. Einstein was probably one of them" - Close Encounters of the Third Kind
*edited on a Mac PowerBook, of course. Mac: There is no substitute*
[ This Message was edited by: sapporobaby on 2005-08-24 18:41 ]
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Posted: 2005-08-24 19:37:02
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Sapporobaby,
WMA Lossless is what my library is encoded in, and there are no quality issues, as there is no lossy compression - it is as per the source. It suits me because I use Windows Media Connect to stream to a Roku Soundbridge located with my Hi-Fi, and WMA is the best supported lossless format on that platform. I actually like Windows Media Player 10 very much, and the library capabilities are excellent, and with Windows Media Connect, everything just works. Just my opinion, but the library is also much nicer and better implemented than the iTunes library (which insists on me converting from WMA
)
My library is too large to import into a duplicate iTunes library as well, and everytime I ripped a CD to WMA Lossless for the other reasons I mentioned, I'd have to do the same in iTunes for the phone. Not going to happen
The best I've found so far, is to use Winamp for the phone. I can keep my master library in WMA, and continue to use Windows Media Player/Windows Media Connect for the Roku and the hifi. When I want to put files on the phone, I just use the Transcode plug in within Winamp, and tell it to transcode to the phone at the bitrate and format I choose. It maintains folder structures, doesn't require me to re-rip my library, and in fact, does all that I want, bar offer the Sync functionality that WMP would offer if the phone supported WMA. The only drawback is that I have to use Winamp, rather than WMP. It would be nicer to use WMP for everything, but c'est la vie.
So, I'm almost there really. The other program worth watching, is MediaMonkey. I've received an email from the developers, that it will offer full transcoding in the next release, which is about to go into beta. Until then, I guess I'll stick with my Winamp solution which is by far the slickest solution I've found.
Cheers,
Simon
[ This Message was edited by: siwatkins on 2005-08-24 20:14 ]
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Posted: 2005-08-24 21:13:17
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@siwatkins,
You did not mention the Soundbridge. Makes sense now. I use a Airport Express to run to my Rotel pre-amp via fiber. I can see you problem much clearer now. Yes, the lossless codec is right for you while the phone requires a different solution.
iTunes, well, it sucks as a library. Bottom line but I think this is because of the iPod. It mimics the menu structure so, keep it simple. If you had a Mac, you could write a script to select some songs, transcode them, then delete them after they were uploaded to your phone.
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Posted: 2005-08-24 21:34:17
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Yeah, I the Roku is an important part of the equation, so I should have mentioned that previously
You mentioned scripting - I could I guess, use Windows Scripting Host to do something similar, but given my current laziness, I'll stick to Winamp for getting tunes to the phone for now lol
Cheers for your input,
Simon
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Posted: 2005-08-24 21:49:19
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On 2005-08-24 21:49:19, siwatkins wrote:
Yeah, I the Roku is an important part of the equation, so I should have mentioned that previously
You mentioned scripting - I could I guess, use Windows Scripting Host to do something similar, but given my current laziness, I'll stick to Winamp for getting tunes to the phone for now lol
Cheers for your input,
Simon
Get a Mac and just download a script that someone already has written.
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Posted: 2005-08-24 22:02:11
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