Sony Ericsson / Sony : General : Are SonyEricsson going to produce a 5 megapixel camera phone with optical zoom thats not BIG.
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> Are SonyEricsson going to produce a 5 megapixel camera phone with optical zoom thats not BIG.
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hating joystick is a sign of incoherence and intolerable to twists. quite boring people.
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Posted: 2007-02-02 22:16:05
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On 2007-02-02 12:41:57, janahan wrote:
As a Photographer, I wouldnt think that Optical zoom lenses on a "small" candybar type camera phone is a good idea for many reasons.
For startes adding more lenses (in a lens pack) to allow for optical zoom, would reduce the maximum amount of light coming into the sensor. (this is corresponds to the f number on the lens, the smaller the number the more light allowed in). Less Light coming in has to then be compensated with either greater sensitivity/ISO - which would result in more noise, or longer shutter times - increasing blur from camera movement.
A higher minimum f number would also increase the depth of field, which may be great for landscape shots, but woudl be much less desirable for portraits. Smaller depth of field allows the focus to be adjusted to keep the main object in focus, and bluring everythign outside, giving a good impression of depth, preventing the photo from looking "flat"
This is why professional Photographers go for "Prime" (as opposed to zoom) Lenses, despite less convenience. My Canon DSLR has a zoom lense with an f number tha ranges from f3.5 to f4.7. I am currently looking for a "fast" prime lens of a f1.8. This will decrease the shutter time, as well as create better depth of field for portraits.
Another problem that is more specific to Camera phones, is the size of the lens, and the size of the sensor. No matter how good the sensor is, it will always be crippled by its small size. as such it captures less light, and have lower light resolution (not pixel resolution). This results in more "banding" and apparent Noise or grainyness. Increasing the Megapixel could woudl make the situation worse, not better, and the post processing require may even cancel the megapixel increase.
The smaller lens needs to be of much higher quality. Take the Nokia's with Carl Ziess Optics, and compare it with the K800. Although the K800 captures better shots in low light, and has in general pretty good results, it is let down by the quality of the optics. The K800 exhibits more lens flare, and also a purple fringing on the edges of some objects, an issue that is greatly reduced on the Nokias with Carl Ziess lenses. Adding Optical zoom to this will only increase the problem, as high quality lenses are required (at far greater costs)
Despite saying all this, I dont think its impossible to add optical zoom to a camera phone, but I feel the limitations and size of the platform, would have a severe detriment to the picture quality. IF you need an exmaple, have a look at some of those fancy thin Digital Cameras with the periscope type lense (Like the Sony Cybershot T series, and the Nikon Slims). Even at 5Mp, the quality of the pictures they take is poor compared to any decent normal type of camera, despite having carl zeiss optics.
you know your stuff eh?
[ This Message was edited by: tupac1 on 2007-02-02 21:48 ]
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Posted: 2007-02-02 22:47:45
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On 2007-02-02 13:10:42, floke wrote:
@shaliron: What do you mean by "stacked components" ?
Well, I mean the camera sensor, the screen, and other components need to be stacked on top of each other. That increases the thickness, but at least the phone is fairly well sized width and length wise. Something like that.
That's why thin phones tend to be very wide and tall in comparison to 'normal' phones, because the components aren't stacked as much, but more spread out.
And I agree that fitting optical zoom into a phone as small as the K800 is a little ambitious at the moment.
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Posted: 2007-02-03 01:07:05
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sharp have already done it, a couple of years ago even.
If you can put one in razor thin cameras, you can put one in not so razor thin phone cameras. I take janaham's point, but it's all about technology and technology is changing VERY quickly.
Technology solves all these problems and more.
I personally feel confident that a 5MP optical zoom camera from SE will be more than adequate, and hopefullly in doing so they will recognise the need for better quality optics. SE don't normally make something that's takes worse photos than it's predecessor. So far each camera is a definite improvement on the previous model, both on specs and performance.
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Posted: 2007-02-03 02:45:58
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I agree. I only have confidence in SonyEricsson to make the best camera phones as even though Nokia make good ones the overall image quality of their camera phones is not perfect. LGs 5 mega pixel phone was horrible and very good and Sharps is now too dated and big. And i believe only SonyEricsson will get it right as so far the K800i in my opinion is the only great one so far. Will someone make SE read this. If they are going to make the 5 mega pixel phone with a joy stick please make it more tactile and reliable. Thanks.
This message was posted from a 6233
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Posted: 2007-02-03 03:07:21
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Stupid MoreMoreMegaPixels Guys understand at last that more megapixels does NOT mean better quality !
Picture quality is affected by the QUALITY and not the megapixel count of the sensor.
2 Mpx with good lens and big sized low-noise sensor produces much better pictures then a tiny 5 Mpx sensor put into a phone under small plastic lens.
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Posted: 2007-02-03 08:02:25
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And I'd also like to add that the super thin cameras (AFAIK) sometimes use mirrors to achieve the 3x zoom. So the sensor will sit 90 degrees in comparison to the lenses.
And that's how Panasonic managed to fit a 10x zoom into its TZ1.
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Posted: 2007-02-03 09:52:10
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yep, and there are lenses in development that are actually a series of enfolded flat and curved mirrors, so that the resulting zoom lense is a flat disc (axxxr did a post on it).
Of course a phone will never have the same quality as the latest pro digicams, or even mid range digicams. for example 3.2MP (the K800) is below the market standard (5-6MP for a basic digicam). But the relartionship is proportionate, so as digicams standards increase so do Camera phones.
The megapixel argument is irrelevant to quality - what counts is the quality of the censor not it's resolution, otherwise you could say the K800 3.2MP camera is as good as a Canon EOS 3MP SLR. It isn't, and we don't need no photo comparo to prove that!
As digital camera technology gets better and better so will camera phones, not just megapixels, but other improvements in quality will also trickle down to camera phones. But they will always just remain a little behind mainstream digital cameras.
I'd like to say one thing about resolution though, at some point lack of useable resolution DOES affect quality. For example it doesn't matter how good a VGA quality sensor you have, VGA pictures do not print well as 4x6 photos.
Also, even if quality is poor, with more megapixels you can blow up areas of the photo; if it were lower resolution you would have no flexibility in that regard. I agree without hesitation that all things considered quality is better than megapixels, but for some applications megapixels wins over quality.
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Posted: 2007-02-03 16:00:40
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