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The UK is a small country we cannot keep taking in the amount of people at the current rate its just not right. We are over crowded and its putting strain on everything. If we keep immigration at the current rate in years to come we will no longer have any countryside left or any beautiful places to visit in the UK due to stupid amount of house building needed. I am not being racist for saying this like i said i have friends from other countries. My family were immigrants from Ireland many years ago. Also with the current climate of jobs being thin on the ground why oh why are we still letting in thousands every week? All they will do is go straight onto benefits so how is that saving money? I do not agree with The BNP on anything they say except the current over crowding and stupid immigration policy. What is going on? There is no jobs left all our industry goes abroad yet everyone is coming here for work? Its backwards. I can see some peoples point in feeling let down by mainstream politics and having their values and livelyhoods taken away. People then come here who have never contributed to this country and they are given everything. Thats why they feel fed up and feel like rebelling against government. I seen a bloke on the news who had worked for 35 years in the same job. He was made redundant and he was REFUSED job seekers allowance. Why? He should be entitled to it after paying into the system for all them years. Then thousands of immigrants pop over the channel and are given hundreds of pounds a week in benefits. This is true and its going on. And these are some of the reasons people are feeling this way. But saying all this at the same time i dont agree with the way the BNP wish to deal with issues. Its wrong and racist. There are thousands of immigrants who have been here years and worked hard and paid into the system and its their home.

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Money is exactly like sex, you think of nothing if you don't have it, and think of everything else if you do!!

[ This Message was edited by: Bonovox on 2009-10-26 23:18 ]
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Posted: 2009-10-27 00:14:00
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Well well well ... it's been a long time since I posted in a political thread on Esato. Let's see if I can still manage it ...

The first thing to say is that the BNP is an utterly odious party that is centred around notions of race. No matter how you look at their policies they are based upon the concept of defining different races and pitting one section of society against another i.e. 'them versus us'.

Was it right to have a representative of the BNP on Question Time? Absolutely. This is a free society and everyone has the right to express their views, no matter how offensive those views may be. Someone asked why people should be allowed to stand on street corners calling for this country to be ruined, the answer is again free speech. Free speech is not just the right to say nice things, or even controversial things, it is the right to say anything you want, no matter how offensive that may be. Expression cannot be free if you place any limit on it. You may not like what someone else says, but that is part of living in a democracy. I detest the BNP's views, but I would die in a ditch to defend their right to express those views; as Voltaire said "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."

The other point in all of this is immigration. People are saying the UK is overcrowded, well that is true to an extent. This is a small island and we do have a large population that is predicted to reach 70 million rather soon. However, there are a few points those who bang on about immigration need to consider. For one thing there are many jobs that many people in this country apparently don't want to do e.g. menial jobs that are low paying. You will often find immigrants doing some of the worst and lowest paid jobs in our society. They work hard and support their families and contribute to the wealth of this country. I don't see many of the lazy benefit spongers that complain so loudly about immigrants taking jobs or getting houses actually getting up off their backsides and taking one of those jobs. No, they would rather sponge off the state and let hard working people, immigrant or otherwise, pay for their lifestyles.

Those of you who do work and who complain about immigrants think of this, many immigrants who come to this country have valuable skills. They are doctors, teachers, scientists and engineers. They help our country grow and prosper, adding value to our society that makes all our lives better.

No one has the right to a nice house or a large wage or a fancy car. You have to work for them. You have to get off your behind and go out and slog for them. Many people seem to blame everyone but themselves far too easily. We have too much of a victim mentality and entitlement complex in this country. Quite frankly I would scrap benefits for all but the most needy in society. Make people stand on their own two feet and maybe they will realise just how hard it is for many immigrants to give up their families and their homes to move half way across the planet in search of a better life here.

That is the crux of the matter. People who aren't doing well look for someone to blame. It's a trap people have fallen into all too often over the years. In Germany it was the Jews and now here in Britain we see the BNP using ethnic minorities in general, and the Muslim population in particular as scapegoats. Their policy is so ludicrous as to be almost comical, if it weren't so vile. If you want this country to prosper then get immigrants in! Attract people with valuable skills, with a can-do attitude that want to work and contribute. Don't shut them out.

As for Nick Griffin being 'bullied' ... cry me a river! He made himself look like the fool he is. The other panellists were simply speaking common sense. He was given the opportunity to express his views and he did so, that they were so repugnant to anyone with a shred of decency was what solicited the response he got, not an attempt at bullying him. Nick Griffin and the BNP are not British. They may wrap themselves in the Union Jack, but when have Britons have Britons ever been overly nationalistic? Where are their concepts of fair play? They lack basic British attributes like fair play and tolerance. No, they are very far from being British.

If you vote for the BNP then you are voting against Britain. You are voting against everything my grandfathers were willing to risk their lives to protect, everything your grandfathers were willing to risk their lives to protect. You are voting against the sacrifices made by millions of people throughout the centuries to keep these islands we call home free. You are voting against basic human decency.

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Posted: 2009-10-27 01:59:49
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I have always worked and never wish to life on the dole its degrading and depressing. When i say about immigrants i dont mean the decent hard working ones who have come here and contributed and ones who have been here years. I mean there are so many coming here who actually know of our benefits system so they do come here hoping to get a free ride. I am not saying they all do thats not true. Why are so many trying to get to Britain after travelling miles across Europe? Why not stay in one of the other countries in Europe who actually have more space than we do? Its because they know of our easy benefits system. Do not say its untrue because it is. We are a soft touch. Simple. Germany are heavily populated and France they even have more immigrants than we do. But they are also larger countries. I have nothing against Muslims or any other religion we are all the same human race. But something has got to give this country is under strain from immigration. As for the lazy generation that puts the UK to shame as i can see. Polish people have come here in a short space of time and worked hard. They are nice people the Polish. As for free speech. I myself think its wrong if you are living in this country and you are a part of this society. Why the hell are people on our streets saying they want to bomb or kill our government? I am sorry but thats not free speech thats inciting hatred and murder. Its not free speech. Human Rights laws are a joke because everything goes in favour of the criminal. Laws and rights in this country have become backwards and not in favour of decent people. Its no wonder this countries citizens are pissed off and i say that even for immigrants who work hard and people of immigrant families who were born here. As i said i dont agree with the BASTARD NATIONAL PARTY but it is getting too much.

_________________
Money is exactly like sex, you think of nothing if you don't have it, and think of everything else if you do!!

[ This Message was edited by: Bonovox on 2009-10-27 11:09 ]
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Posted: 2009-10-27 11:58:00
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I wonder what the working knowledge of the British benefits system is amongst the average person in another country? I have a feeling that most people don't know very much about it. I would dispute the idea that there are many people coming to this country simply to sponge. If one actually thinks about that idea one quickly realises that it actually sounds rather absurd. Someone must be prepared to give up their home, their family and their friends to travel half way across the world to a strange country to then wait in line at a post office to receive some money each week. That is what they are travelling so far for in essence. Personally I very much doubt many people do in fact come to Britain for the sole purpose of living on benefits.

Instead I would put it that many people come here because they see Britain as one of the best places in Europe, if not the world, to make a new life for themselves. Why do they pass other countries? Well there are many reasons. First of all immigrants may have English as a second language, they are much less likely to have Italian, Hungarian, Swedish, etc as a second language. Hence they may opt for Britain to help ease their transition. Then there is also how they perceive Britain. In many parts of the world Britain is the most familiar European country given that Britain used to own a quarter of the planet. Beyond either of those points though it may simply be the case that many immigrants see Britain as a free, prosperous society that is governed by the rule of the law, and where they can hopefully live a happy and prosperous life.

The simplest solution to the whole issue would be to end the benefits system in this country. Help should be provided to the disabled, chronically ill, the elderly, and those with children. Everyone else should stand on their own two feet and not rely on the government to provide for them. That would simultaneously put to bed any ideas that people are coming to the UK just for benefits and it would end the victim/entitlement mentality so many people have.

As for freedom of speech, again no limit can be placed upon it or it is not free. I certainly don't condone anyone demanding the overthrow of our democratic form of government, but they still have a right to say that. If you start limiting what people say then you no longer live in a free society, instead you are living in a police state where the authorities can decide what can and cannot be said. It is irrelevant whether everyone else agrees or disagrees with your point of view, the only thing that matters is that you be allowed to express it. Other people can then decide what to make of your views.
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Posted: 2009-10-27 15:44:07
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I wouldn't be posting here if the BNP got in 40 years ago
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Posted: 2009-10-27 16:13:09
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Mr Griffin leads a nasty and evil party. I used to work in a BNP area as a student and was regularly abused and attacked. My English is better than those that I fought with. My contribution to this country is significant, my workplace is internationally recognised and the leader in the UK. I pay tax, I get no benefits from anyone.

For me London is the best city in Europe for me to practice my faith and live my lifestyle but I will always stand up against people who have a problem with my skin colour or religion. These b*****ds gave me hell for looking a little different and i'll never forget it. They can all rot in hell and Mr Griffin can go and copulate with his mother.
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Posted: 2009-10-28 01:43:31
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Yes i agree their ideas are wrong and racist. Many people from a different background or skin colour settled here after the 2nd world war and since then many have been born here. Its the same everywhere the whole world is now multi cultural. But its a problem we are always going to face people like this will always exist no matter what you do everywhere. In countries like Russia and Germany there are still Neo Nazis groups causing problems. There are groups in my friends country Hungary who have similar views. In the country of my family Ireland there are many immigrants now and recently people suffered such bad racist attacks that they had to leave. My personal opinion is we should NOT give them publicity because it just fuels the flames and tensions begin. I actually think Britain does not too bad for community relations these days. When years ago we had many riots on the streets of Bradford Birmingham and Brixton. But these days i dont see as many which is good. France and Germany have many more muslims than we do relations seem good over there except for the Paris riots a couple of years back. I think there is a party in France with similar views to the BNP but people like that will never get into power its not going to happen.
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Posted: 2009-10-28 02:10:00
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He is too stupid to be that..
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Posted: 2009-10-28 20:53:06
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racists! in australia we have Paulson Hanline (or is it Pauline Hanson of onenation?)
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Posted: 2009-10-30 08:22:00
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