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< Esato Forum Index > Sony Ericsson / Sony > Symbian phones > Satio - 12mp vs 5 mp - This is how they sell phones! Bookmark topic

all SE phones take red pictures by default. Xenon and no xexnon they are all red-ish. Aka. THEY SUCK HORSEBALLS!
no detail at all. all fine detail are washed out. When nokia used this much noise reduction you all where "nokia sucks" and now SE uses it, and all look like painting, now some of you still have a nice tongue and know how to use it to worship SE.
I have had it with SE since my G900 and then the final drop was the Satio.
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Posted: 2010-10-23 20:08:48
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well you guys are missing the point here, downsizing a 12mp photo to 5mp is exactly what you are doing, it is a smaller picture with less pixels, now try zooming a 5mp picture 10x then do the same with a 12mp picture without altering the pixel density then you will see the difference, picture size does not equate to pixel count it indicates zoom level or density, as an example, take a look at a newspaper picture really close - it will be made up of tiny dots, now zoom a section of it with a magnifying glass, the picture increasesin size but the pixcel density stays the same.
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Posted: 2010-10-24 12:39:32
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Looking at the first post, there is a difference between the 5MP photos and the 12 MP ones, but the only difference is resolution. Both 5MP and 12MP have the same terrible quality, at ISO 500 the noise covers everything.
Having 12MP doesn't mean better picture quality, it just means more resolution, which you can only really use when its sunny otherwise all your cropping is noise. Since when did people need so much resolution on camera-phones anyway?

The 12MP downsized to 5MP look slightly better than the 5MP ones, but only very slight better resolution.
Using 5MP instead of 12MP wont increase quality, it will only save space and if I had a satio I would keep maximum resolution and stick to taking photos in good light.
As AbuBasim says, the photo quality is not just about the sensor, it's also about good optics, something that is unrealistic to put in a phone, and satio's potential detail with the 12 MP resolution is totally ruined by its processing.

Nokia E72 crushed the satio in the comparison, E72 has much more detail, satio pics have a huge amount of noise reduction added in processing. The Satio photos are more saturated than the E72, I prefer E72 - much more detail, more realistic colours.
Why are the E72 photos re-sized to 12MP? I think it would be better to see each camera at its original resolution and compare details that way - should be Satio @ 12MP vs Nokia E72 @ 5MP.

In regards to satio - what's the point in having such a high resolution when excessive noise reduction and compression ruins any potential detail?
I aggree with your conclusion, I'm not sure about 'fake' resolution, the amount of detail produced has a lot to do with the processing the camera does to produce the JPEG, such as sharpening, noise reduction, and saturation.
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Posted: 2010-10-24 14:32:34
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@ gharknes1: In the first row of examples you have upsized photos. There you can see that even expanded 5MP photos keep the same detail as original 12MP ones (might be a very small difference however I believe it's caused by the stronger JPEG compression).

@ mriley: I have upsized E72 photos so we can compare both phones at the same resolution and therefore show that Satio is not a 12MP phone. It is a 5MP phone, with a 12MP mode that expands it's 5MP captures to 12MP!
If I add some noise reduction to E72 12MP photos I get with a photo just like Satio's, still slightly better.
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Posted: 2010-10-24 15:21:26
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That's not true though, you're only evidence for that is that when 5MP E72 photos are scaled up to 12MP they look comparable (better) than the Satio's shots.
There's a difference between picture size and the amount of megapixels on a sensor, there are 12 million pixels on the satio's sensor, not 5 million, so it does produce 12 MP photos. The only thing is that makes the pictures turn out so bad is the processing and compression after the photo has been captured.
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Posted: 2010-10-24 22:27:50
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Well, I've been using Satio for this last couple of days and I've changed my mind. I'll keep my E72 and I'll sell my silver Satio. I'll sacrifice some advantages of Satio's camera (mainly xenon and practical lens cover) for E72's overall experience, which is better in my opinion. For good photos I have my K-x!

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Posted: 2010-10-24 23:21:01
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Good decision
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Posted: 2010-10-25 00:28:34
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man i was angry at you for posting full sized pictures on this thread... and alot of them. Had to wait eons to load, and i wasn curious about them, i just wanted to read and because they loaded page jumped alot.
:/
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Posted: 2010-10-25 20:14:10
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Yeah man, sorry about that. Now imagehack has this zoom-in thing and that makes it download the full photo first. ;f
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Posted: 2010-10-25 22:04:46
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@Zide, I'm afraid your tests are flawed. I can see differences in your first post. I don't dismiss your intention, you clearly feel that the E72 results in a better picture.. probably due to your preference in the white balance.. many people prefer cooler temperatures to the warm balance the Satio has.

As for resolution, the Satio set to 12MP takes pictures with better detail than set in 5MP. You need to compare 12MP photo with 5MP photo.. don't resize.. look at the fine detail in each picture when you zoom down to near pixel resolution.

Your first test (resizing 5MP up to 12MP) clearly shows differences in picture quality, refuting your claim. If you can't see those differences, zoom in. But the real test should be done with 5MP photo against 12MP photo with no resize conversions.

As for white balance, every camera has it's own levels... in Auto mode, camera's from different manufacturers will have different white balance results as they have their own methods of determining the Auto levels. People's preference to a cool or warm level is down to individual perception and I agree, is enough in most cases to switch peoples decision on which camera to buy, even though all camera's have a manual white balance setting... which should ultimately be used, because Auto levels are just a convenient setting for general use and don't always get it right, depending on the conditions.
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Posted: 2010-10-26 14:18:11
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