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@mckinley:

market share alone does not give a good indication on whether one has an edge over the other.

2 years ago SE was on the verge of dying but was brought back to life by T610. it doesnt mean now SE has arrived and will continue to surge ahead. if u look at se competitors such as Siemens, Samsung, LG - they are introducing a wider range of models compared to SE. and in this market number of models matters.

Similarly, we are seeing Nokia reversing the trend with pricing factor and also introduction of more significant models like the 6230, 7610, 6630, 6260, 7200, 6170 and recently the fashion trio. some of these are state of the art.

you may criticise the 6230 for having a small screen and nokia fans can criticise the K700 for not having a memory slot. but the reality is that in many markets the 6230 is still outselling the K700. and SE is solely dependent on K700 but nokia is not with 6230. at the same price range Nokia has smartphones.

now come my main point. the main threat to SE is coming from the Samsung bulldozer. Previously growth of Samsung and lesser extent Moto was at the expense of Nokia.

with nokia market share stabilised, and if the samsung bulldozer continues, who do u think samsung is going to grab share from? so the million dollar question is can SE maintain its market share with its meagre offering?

this is classic case of giants (Nokia/Samsung/Moto) fighting, and smaller ones getting squashed. the smaller ones may get a breather in a growing market like this year but in a lean year...who knows?



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Posted: 2004-09-27 04:13:34
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@mib1800

I don't think anyone can say that Nokia have stabilised their market share based upon the last couple of years. I would imagine that we will have to look at Nokia's performance over the next few years before we can make a proper judgement on how much competition is affecting it.
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Posted: 2004-09-27 19:56:34
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well this discussion has moved around a bit so will try to go back to answer the original question re the update service.
siemens has offered this service for a while and it hsnt done an awful lot for there sales. i guess it depends on how the service is sold to the consumer ie if you sell it as this will sort out any bugs the phone has. is nt imo a great selling point as people will think i dont wannna buy a phone with any problems in the first
have they got an edge over nokia yes as they have an update service and nokia dont.its weather its an edge that matter to a large percentage of phone buyers
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Posted: 2004-09-27 20:31:36
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aguila2's and mib1800,
As I said in an earlier post, I have worked in Vodafone store and we got develope copy of Nokia 6230 and that one had a lot of flaws.
Yes it was a bit stupid by me to believe that Nokia wouldn't support MP3 stereo and possibility to play radio through loud speaker but still 6230 lags behind according to me. K700i could pretty easy outsell Nokia 6230 if it wasn't because of all production problems SE has.
Nokia had this problem with 6230 when it first hit the market.

I guess you guys know that K700i was the phone of the month when it came and T610 was the phone of the year 2003, this itself tells pretty much what people in this business think about Sony Ericsson's handsets.

LG is still behind Sony Ericsson by abit more than 1% and nothing is going to change on that this year as a matter of fact, the lead over LG will not decline. 1% is not much but they don't have strong products at the moment. Potential customers choose Samsung instead of LG since they both look pretty much the same but with Samsung as a stronger brand.
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Posted: 2004-09-27 23:29:30
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Quote:
On 2004-09-27 23:29:30, McKinley wrote:
aguila2's and mib1800,
K700i could pretty easy outsell Nokia 6230 if it wasn't because of all production problems SE has.


are you serious? come on, nokia sold 1,5 milion 6230 over last Q. SE sold 1/20 of k700i. and I don't thing the difference was only due to the production problems


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Posted: 2004-09-28 01:23:35
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Quote:
On 2004-09-27 19:56:34, scotsboyuk wrote:
@mib1800

I don't think anyone can say that Nokia have stabilised their market share based upon the last couple of years. I would imagine that we will have to look at Nokia's performance over the next few years before we can make a proper judgement on how much competition is affecting it.



true. it's very difficult to predict what's down the road (just like who can predict the SE comeback story)

i'm just refering to Nokia recent rut. at least Nokia has regained some lost market share for the last quarter (i.e. it outperforms the market). we may still see some steam left in Nokia.

like i say, imo, SE has more to fear from Samsung and Siemes than Nokia. at its current state Nokia looks quite benign.



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Posted: 2004-09-28 03:48:43
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@McKinley

if according to your reason, SE is still having problem with its production since K700 released, that's a long time ago (in cellphone time). if it still cannot solve this after all this time, then something maybe wrong with SE.

edited: believe SE also hv problems with T610 production.

[ This Message was edited by: mib1800 on 2004-09-28 03:24 ]

[ This Message was edited by: mib1800 on 2004-09-28 03:27 ]
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Posted: 2004-09-28 04:22:43
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@mib1800

I don't any of Nokia's rivals actually have anyhting to fear from Nokia in terms of their market share, not just SE. Samsung is a particuarly strong player, but their lack of Bluetooth may soon prove to be a problem for them unless of course they start manufacturing mobiles with Bluetooth. Motorola is another strong contender and has been releasing several popular models of late. SE really needs to be setting itself obtainable goals; unseating Nokia is not possible in the short term, but increasing market share at the expense of manufacturers like Siemens and Samsung is.

I think SE have been correct in opting to concentrate on a few products rather than opting to flood the market with lots of options. Competition is very fierce because of market saturation, but by releasing powerful mobiles equipped with good features, SE is able to draw away customers from other manufacturers.

The 3G market is, in my opinion, where we shall see the real battle. 3G market penetration is relatively low so all the manufacturers will be able to start on a level playing field.
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Posted: 2004-09-28 05:00:13
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@scotsboyuk

i hope u r right about advantage of SE concentrating on a few products. frankly, i do like some of SE products like T610, K700 and P900. (maybe the design is more suited to my taste)

however, i still hv a niggling feeling that there is a flip side. people still want new "model". if a phone stays around for longer than avg, then it is perceived to be obsoleted eventhough the tech is not.

the main strength of Samsung is in making and repackaging cute and small clamshell. Maybe it has learn this from Nokia (repackaging part and releasing many models). Seems like Siemens is also on this path. SE and Nokia clamshells (which are big and bulky) on the other hand are still lacking behind.

samsung has just announced they will be supporting BT in their new phones. furthermore, their first gsm smartphone D710 will be out soon. so on the tech side, it is even playing field. rumour has also that LG series 60 is on the way.



[ This Message was edited by: mib1800 on 2004-09-28 05:24 ]
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Posted: 2004-09-28 06:19:40
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@mib1800

I was just reading an article on Samsung clamshells and how they tend to be very similar to one another, with very little difference between them. Samsung seem to be walking down Nokia's path.

SE on the other hand appear to be following a different road; selective models packed with features and built to a high standard.
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Posted: 2004-09-28 19:10:03
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