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On 2003-08-26 04:48:14, Scots_boyuk wrote:
Although basic physics does indeed say that energy cannot come from 'nowhere' this very scenario can actually happen. It has been demonstrated on a number of occassions and requires no more than two highly polished metal sheets. As yet there is no satisfactory explanation of this effect.
You are referring to the Cassamir Effect and it is well understood and has nothing to do with this.
The Cassimir Effect occurs when two very flat plates are held very close together in a vacuum. Despite what you may think, a vacuum is not empty. Quantum Mechanics tells us that virtual particles are constantly popping in to existance before disappearing again a tiny fraction of a second later. Quantum Mechanics also tells us that particles can also be considered as waves, and so each has a "De Broglie" wavelength. If the plates are held together with a spacing smaller than the De Broglie wavelength of the particles in the "vacuum soup" then no virtual particles can exist in that space. As a result, between the plates is a true vacuum, while outside there are particles hitting the sides of the plates.
The result of this is there is a positive pressure on the outside of the plates which exerts a force that pushes the plates together. While many people have fantasised about turning this in to a source of free energy, you can't. The energy required to pull the plates apart so that the cycle could repeat would be greater than the energy gain in the first place. No free lunch!
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Posted: 2003-08-26 18:54:29
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@ Little Jon
Fair enough, as I said before my speciality was Astrophysics, not electrical engineering. I am pretty sound with theoretical physics, but not so hot on applied physics. Cheers for the info.
Has anyone asked the manufacturer how they claim it works?
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Posted: 2003-08-26 18:59:23
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Well, I am not an Astrophysicist, have very little knowledge of physics, electrical engineering or applied or theoretical whatever...what I seem to know much more about than any of you here is practical usage of the battery extender.
My P800 was last charged full on Sunday afternoon and has not been turned off. I am now at 57% and have made at least an hour of calls today, surfed for 30-35 minutes, and all the other bits and pieces without including all my usage on Sunday and monday. I reckon this extender whatever it is made of is giving me at least another full day of use...well worth it in my opinion. You can argue all you like and call it BS or whatever...I took the plunge, bought one even though it seemed unlikely to work...well, to my suprise it has worked and I have no idea why and I really don't give a damn!
The best way to win this discussion is to at least have experience of the product in question!
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Posted: 2003-08-26 20:56:15
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http://www.okabetrading.co.jp/Denpita.htm
Read this for more info....
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Posted: 2003-08-26 21:14:58
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@Little Jon
I am aware that a vacuum isn't entirely empty, but I didn't want to go into too much detail to avoid numbing people who don't understand the principles behind it. I am in agreement with you that it is totally impractical, I was merely pointing it out in reference to another post that energy can't come from 'nowhere'.
The Casimir effect isn't the only instance of energy appearing from 'nowhere', depending on the model you are using there are theories to allow for it, but I won't go into them here because;
a:) they have bugger all to do with anyone or anything
b:) I highly doubt they are being employed in this product
c:) I can't be arsed!
Maybe the battery extender absorbs farts and converts it into extra energy? Anyone with good reports on it been farting a lot lately?:P
Cheers
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Posted: 2003-08-26 21:38:03
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That energy doesn't actually come from "nowhere". It comes from "elsewhere" (I am referring to the Casimir effect). According to the law of conservation of energy - it can not come from 'nowhere', nor can it disappear into 'nothing.' .. But that's beside the point. The point is that the explanation given officialy with the product has nothing to do with conservation of energy, heat sinking or heat isolation. According to the offical explanation, the new "material" generates "cavity energy" which causes ions to flow "straight". That sentense alone is enough to make me sceptical about the whole product, especially since ions in the battery don't flow along some sort of lines, but flow through a more or less heterogeneous solution; and cavities don't generate energy.
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Answers to the most common questions on Esato forums[ This Message was edited by: wrath000 on 2003-08-26 20:48 ]
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Posted: 2003-08-26 21:46:53
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I'm sceptical too, but no one who has bought it has said that it didn't work on their p800. It is only $9 (about £6?) so its not a fortune, then again maybe we would get the same effect by wrapping tin foil round our batteries (oh that sounds quite saucey).
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Posted: 2003-08-26 21:53:39
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It's unlikely that anyone who bought it and found it didn't work would post here because of all the kids that would pounce on them and call them idiots.
Why don't all you sceptics buy one and try it out? We are talking about US$10 post included to literally anywhere in the world! If you can afford the P800 then this isn't going to break the bank.
If it doesn't work for you then stop shopping from where you bought it. I have never had any bother from P800er.com. I buy, they ship, I receive. If these didn't work I wouldn't buy from them again. It's that simple.
By the way, it's not onlpy P800er.com that sells them. Do a search on Google and you will find others (just in case you think I work for P800er.com!). I don't care where you buy it from so long as you test it yourself and see your own results.
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Posted: 2003-08-26 22:29:30
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I remember exactly the same saga with the signal booster (the one you attached under your battery), which was supposed to greatly improve the signal strenght. Everybody who bought one claimed that it worked, and did wonders for them. They could go places they couldn't go before, and still have signal, etc.... This lasted until it was prooved that signal booster didn't not improve signal strengh, but actually decreased it or had negative effects on the phone. Then, and only then did the complaints come. The same thing was with that little sticker which was supposed to protect mobile users from harmfull radiation. Human mind tends to see things the way it desires. You see what you want to see, especially if you invest some money in it.
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If I had all the answers, I wouldn't have any questions.
Answers to the most common questions on Esato forums[ This Message was edited by: wrath000 on 2003-08-26 21:51 ]
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Posted: 2003-08-26 22:50:02
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@Provi Guy
It doesn't matter how it works! It gives me a chance to drone on about high end physics and bore people with my smart arse comments:P (Observe that great British trait of self-depreciating wit).
Whilst I've been writing this, I've decided what the hey! I've just ordered one.
Senses more opportunities for endless prattle ahead ... moo ha ha ha!
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Posted: 2003-08-26 22:54:34
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