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The author of Ben Hur believed the same, with some right points re imposed religion, untill he red the New Testament. After that he wrote his famous book. Have you ever red the N T? BTW self determination is just a deadly illusion. Ask those under dictatorial regims. God bless This message was posted from a Z600
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Posted: 2004-08-20 20:11:40
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I guess I have a problem with organised religion, which I'm guessing @thereverend is part of! I suspect that this would be a case of the irresistable force against the immovable object, neither of us will give way, so I'm not sure if a debate will be a good idea.

btw I've read parts of the NT - there's no denying that what's written in the bible and other religious texts provide an excellent blueprint for living life unselfishly and with care for others. Also, having holidayed on some of the Greek islands, where many people are still religious, people are a lot nicer to each other, there's still a sense of community, and there seems to be a lot less crime (I've seen scooters parked at the side of the road - with their keys still IN the ignition!!).

However, I do have a problem with 'supreme' beings, their existence, and this 'believe in me or you'll go straight to hell without collecting £200' mentality. Once we learn to look after ourselves as a species, without relying on outdated methods of control (i.e. religion, which is basically what it is - look at totalitarian religous-based regimes), we will have made a huge evolutionary leap forward.

Apologies for my rather atheist view there, I'm going to feel a bit of a prat if there really is a heaven!
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Posted: 2004-08-20 21:02:26
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Most excellent friend, I'm by no means member of the 'organized' religious system. I'm just another sinner saved by Jesus, and a theology graduate because of my deep need to know Him. I attend a very small Calvary Chapel church in Hungary. Re 'evolution' guess what? I teach, write, and translate about biblical and scientific creationism! God bless This message was posted from a Z600
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Posted: 2004-08-20 21:47:09
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@ TheReverend Thank you for reminding us of G-d's Law; it's good to see a fellow Scripture reader. Perhaps you can clarify some other points that have been on my mind? My neighbour insists on working on the Sabbath. I know he has to be put to death (Exodus 35:2) but do I have to do it myself? Also Exodus 21:7 sanctions me selling my daughter in to slavery. Can you suggest a fair price to ask? Thanks. This message was posted from a T68i
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Posted: 2004-08-20 21:51:28
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@absinthe - re. selling your daughter into slavery, try Ebay mate, you can sell anything and everything there!

@thereverend - looks like I guessed wrong! It also looks like you know your onions, I sadly have no such qualifications. I could probably take your phone apart, show you a few things in the night sky (I'm a very ameteur astronomer!), or tell you a bit about mental illness (I'm a student psychiatric nurse), but that's about my limit.
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Posted: 2004-08-20 22:02:30
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@absinthebri, First question Solved by Jesus, for second check out the stock ex rates:-D This message was posted from a Z600
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Posted: 2004-08-20 22:02:31
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@ Rev Would that be the same Jesus who told us to turn the other cheek and to love everyone? I don't remember him supporting the death penalty (set us free from it, if anything). This message was posted from a T68i
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Posted: 2004-08-20 22:17:04
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@absi, Reading the book of Revelations, you'll notice that Jesus isn't only the Lamb, but the Lion of Judah too! Not to mention the woe's! God bless This message was posted from a Z600
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Posted: 2004-08-20 23:25:52
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Remind me where executing criminals is discussed in Revs? Or do you just find jumping from book to book and topic to topic easier? This message was posted from a T68i
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Posted: 2004-08-20 23:31:54
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No one should be put to death by the hands of another person in my opinion, but unfortunately it happens all too often in this cruel world of ours. where is the love? This message was posted from a P900
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Posted: 2004-08-21 00:17:51
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