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WOOSH. there go's our planets environment down the pan for another 4 years. Bush and 59m people are very narrow minded and selfish...
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Posted: 2004-11-04 09:10:23
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I think we are all aware like Vlammetje said that democracies mean we all vote based on national borders, and quite frankly I wouldn’t even mind if Bush becomes president of Timbabtu. The problem is US is the most powerful country and the policies of the US president does have an impact of the rest of the world. Maybe if US starts attacking Amsterdam (Vlammetje), you'd get a bit of perspective of things. I have my origins in Iran and yes I am pissed off with Americans for voting Bush in coz you know what, my hometown might be the next target of Bush's liberalization movement.
To me this election was at much a referendum on Bush's policies as it is of American's intelligence. While nearly 50% passed the test, I think the other 50% failed miserably. I mean come on, forget the usual dilemma between the interest of the world V local interests or foreign policies V national policies, even if Americans were all selfish and didn’t gave a twat bout the rest of the world, they should have voted him out coz he was screwing up America (economy, job loss, privatizing social security). Unbelievable!!!
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Posted: 2004-11-04 10:03:13
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nickorooster Posts: > 500
Well, New Zealand must be the most sensible country I've really seen... Johnny Howard as Dubbya's best buddy, Blair as more than just a buddy... Well, I'm sure if you behave urselves NZ will let you in.
If I was still under-down-under, then I'd let ya'll in...
Your ticket would be an election slip with Kerry or Nader (or others) punched.
Nick
Edit: Hey man, don't apologise. You did all you can in your semi-democratic society. Honestly the whole "State points" system sucks. If you win a state, you get all of that state's points. Why not just split them, or even have a whole country vote, instead if separate state votes.
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[ This Message was edited by: nickorooster on 2004-11-04 09:16 ]
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Posted: 2004-11-04 10:10:07
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On 2004-11-04 10:03:13, alpal wrote:
Maybe if US starts attacking Amsterdam (Vlammetje), you'd get a bit of perspective of things.
aha. having an opinion you do not share is lack of perspective.
Maybe you'd be interested to know that my country houses the international court. The very same court mr Bush has vowed to denounce. The same court mr Bush has said will suffer the consequences if ever an American is tried there.
You'll be most pleased to know a law was passed under mr Bush's administration that dictates that America has allowed themsleves to invade my country in the interest of any Americans tried by said international court.
Everybody in my country knows this. I doubt many americans still remember this though. And if they do..... perhaps to them it may be a PLUS rather then a minus.
That too is all a matter of perspective.
Truth is that i am not too worried about any US invasions over here. Because I am convinced the International Court will yield to the US and no american will ever stand trial there. Is justice served by this? Not at all. Does anybody care? Not at all.
The fact that 59 million Americans choose Bush does not make every single one of them an idiot. Some of them truly believe he's on the right course. Others think he oughta fix his own mess first.
But
most think changing commands during ongoing war (suddenly it is a war again then...) would be a bad thing to do and might prove harmful to the troops overseas.
And if it were your son out there..... that may well be the biggest issue on your mind.... 'how to get him back home safe and sound'
Some perspective for you perhaps. Americans are just like humans. They worry for their children, they worry for their society. They are afraid of what the future might hold.
And for some reason.... they hope Bush will prove to be the stronger man.
Time will tell.
Being pissed off at all americans won't help much though. What are you going to do? Corner every American you meet on the street and have a go at them? you know what that will do? It will make them more determined. Your only hope of making the 59 million see your perspective is dialogue. Not with Bush but with the 59 million. And you have 4 years to make it happen. You and everybody who is with you.
I wish you much wisdom. Much tolerance. And most of all a broad perspective.
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Posted: 2004-11-04 10:54:08
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As before I find myself agreeing with Vlamm on this issue. I don't see that the attitude most people are taking to this whole process is either progressive or hinting at a plan.
The modern world has been plagued by a lack of conviction or action. Every large political organization in the world today acts more as a guarantee of status quo than a lightning rod for positive change. We've all learned to hide behind our political alliances and cast judgement but not act. Bush, whether right or wrong, is one of the few leaders in the world today acting on his convictions.
As much as a large portion of the world descries the action taken by the U.S. in Afghanistan and Iraq, I've really seen no real effort to put an end to it. How many European citizens flew to the U.S. and campaigned against Bush and his policies? How many of your nations sent aid in the form of military equipment or military personnel to Afghanistan or Iraq to stop the U.S.?
My point here is that there is an abundance of rhetoric against the U.S. and very little follow through. If you feel strongly enough about world politics to complain about them on this message board day after day, find a way that you personally can make a difference.
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Posted: 2004-11-04 11:35:44
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I dont know what will happen but my future is in america! :-):-(
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Posted: 2004-11-04 11:49:49
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I can't believe this thread...
Not being proud of your country (in this case, US)?!??!??!?
Maybe you don't agree with who's in command but ashamed of your country!?!?!?!?
What kind of citizens are you?
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Posted: 2004-11-04 11:57:23
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On 2004-11-04 11:57:23, Krubach wrote:
[....]
What kind of citizens are you?
World citizens.
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Posted: 2004-11-04 11:58:33
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Maybe it's my Portuguese mentality...
I can't believe that someone could be ashamed of his own country...
For instance, here, the other day, some woman got fined for dragging the national flag which was tied to her car.
I LOVE MY COUNTRY! No matter what!
That doesn't mean that i love our leaders...
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Posted: 2004-11-04 12:06:00
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On 2004-11-04 11:35:44, knight4led wrote:
How many European citizens flew to the U.S. and campaigned against Bush and his policies? How many of your nations sent aid in the form of military equipment or military personnel to Afghanistan or Iraq to stop the U.S.?
What would have happened if Europeans had gone to America to protest? Bush has no reason to listen to us, we cannot vote in U.S. elections therefore he has no impetus to listen to our views. No doubt we would also be seen as meddling foreigners. What Europeans did do was to protest in Europe against their own nations aiding America.
There are only two military forces in Europe capable of effective operations on a large scale around the globe; the British and French. Even if either nation had decided to actively aid the Afghanis or Iraqis against the U.S., what would it have achieved? Neither nation has the necessary military power to stop the U.S. in a protracted war and it would have bee a complete waste of lives. To even consider this possibility seems rediculous, both nations are intertwined with the U.S. military, opposing the U.S. in military terms was and never will be an option as long as NATO exists.
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My point here is that there is an abundance of rhetoric against the U.S. and very little follow through. If you feel strongly enough about world politics to complain about them on this message board day after day, find a way that you personally can make a difference.
We do, voters have been voting in increasing numbers for politicians who oppose U.S. policies, which is likely to increase now that Bush has been re-elected. The British newspapers are today full of stories about how Bush's victory is a massive blow for Tony Blair, the level of anger in Britain against Bush is second only to the level of anger at Blair; the next election will be very interesting indeed.
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"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC
[ This Message was edited by: scotsboyuk on 2004-11-04 20:14 ]
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Posted: 2004-11-04 17:42:10
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