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@maxx
great post, but i still dont get why you bring N70 into the equation. Its got a old OS that nokia no longer makes and is widely known to be prone to crashes and hang-ups. Most issues the OS of N70 had have been addressed in the newer version of symbian.
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Posted: 2007-06-05 16:20:37
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sapporbaby, dogman and max, you guys obviously know a lot of stuff on gadgets and it will be intresting to here what you think of "sofia" to you believe in the rumour or think its a lie?
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Posted: 2007-06-05 18:46:21
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On 2007-06-05 18:46:21, KingBooker5 wrote:
sapporbaby, dogman and max, you guys obviously know a lot of stuff on gadgets and it will be intresting to here what you think of "sofia" to you believe in the rumour or think its a lie?
whats the rumor about it?
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Posted: 2007-06-05 19:48:10
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Hi Max,
I said were and that is in past tense and the only real advantage was down to low level light pictures due to the Xenon flash Nokia have now addressed this issue.
As for
"One day Nokia will turn around and find that s60 has no discernible advantage over non-smart SE phones."
You really can not be serious this may well be your opinion but to compare Java to one of the best selling and powerful smart phone OS is a joke. I really do doubt Nokia or any other smart phone manufacturer has anything to fear in this. Yes Java does enable dumb phones to achieve certain tasks but if you are right why is there no Java smart phone being produced? as surely if it was so good and so much cheaper to implement some one would of done this by now.
Again you just can not accept the fact that SE is not putting the latest tech in it's devices to suggest they have 3G as showing they do is frankly just silly as if they didn't they would of severely reduced their potential market wouldn't they.
This is exactly what they are doing by not making multiband devices people who need or want these bands just can't choose an SE and that can't be good can it. Stop talking about just Nokia as it is not just them that have all the new Technology's in their devices is it and this is what makes the fact that SE doesn't even more obvious. If it was just Nokia i may be able to give your argument some relevance but it isn't is it?
How come Motorola who came to the UIQ3 platform after SE had realeased their first extremely troubled devices is now about to launch their first UIQ3 device that has everything bar the 3.2 mega pixel camera and has all the tech you could need, admittedly it doesn't have WiFi but with up to 7.2mbps HSDPA it could be argued it doesn't really need it. But it does have a faster chip an better graphics plus of course HSDPA.
@KingBooker5
As for Sofia who knows what this will bring but so far it has been coming for so long it is getting silly as whilst it was a logical advancement from the K800. Since then Nokia have already released one 5 mega pixel camera equipped smart phone and have another one due this year and this time with a Xenon flash as well stealing the SE high ground from them especially as it is a smart phone and it looks likely to arrive before Sophia. Which we don't really have the true spec's for yet and may not even be a smart phone so if it is the same price as the N73/K800 were it is going to have some serious competition IMO.
For now i really do think this thread has run it's course i have made my points more times than i feel necessary and will not continue to repeat them again and again. We are all entitled to our own opinions on this, i have reached the conclusion that very few of us are going to change our position. I rest my case in the facts and until they change there really is nothing more to discuss as the facts speak for themselves.
Marc
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Nokia E61 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Tom Tom 6, AD-46 with Black Shure EC2g
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-06-05 19:10 ]
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Posted: 2007-06-05 20:06:47
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On 2007-06-05 16:20:37, QVGA wrote:
@maxx
great post, but i still dont get why you bring N70 into the equation. Its got a old OS that nokia no longer makes and is widely known to be prone to crashes and hang-ups. Most issues the OS of N70 had have been addressed in the newer version of symbian.
I only drew the parallel because it's my direct experience - but both phones are the same age so it's a valid comparison. I agree that N73 is much better re: crashing etc than the N70. I's just an example of how a non-smartphone CAN compete in some areas with a smartphone.
@dogmann, you use N95 all-in-one as a market leader example, but SE is not because they don't have the latest of everything, then propose a Motorola UIQ3 that doesn't have wifi or a 3MP camera?? WIFI is about more than fast connectivity it's also about connection to wifi hotspots that are invariably free (not to mention fee free connection to home networks). To say HSDPA is equal to wifi is a bit of a draw isn't it? HSDPA is currently still slower than WIFI b, so how can you complain about P990 wifi b (12Mbps) then dismiss wifi as necessary at all? HSDPA is shared by users, just like current 3G services or even GPRS. This means as more users jump on board, ACTUAL speeds drop very quickly to between 10-25% of theoretical maximum. On top of this, as you become further from the tower, speeds decrease - so 7Mbps will only be when no one else is using the network in your cell and you are standing under the cell tower.
So when sitting at home, given a choice between accessing the internet on my home wireless using a wifi B standard P990 or using a HSDPA device for the privelege of paying my operator (when I already have an interent connection in my lounge room) I'll take the P990 over the Motorola!
You get your arguments mixed up.
By extension, if SE have let you down then how can you use the Motorola UIQ3 handset as an example of leadiung edge technology? Only if you claim that the only important leading edge technology is UMTS can you make that argument. And I'm afraid to say that leading edge is about more than UMTS for most people IMHO
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Posted: 2007-06-06 02:15:55
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On 2007-06-05 20:06:47, Dogmann wrote:
How come Motorola who came to the UIQ3 platform after SE had realeased their first extremely troubled devices is now about to launch their first UIQ3 device that has everything bar the 3.2 mega pixel camera and has all the tech you could need
Well I "need" the best camera I can get on a phone, so please don't overlook other people's requirements just because they are unimportant to you.
And did it ever occur to you that Motorola have benefited from SE's experience with UIQ3? Motorola didn't release the first UIQ3 device otherwise I would accept your point. The fact is they have riden SE's coat tails. So it's absolutely wrong in my book to claim that Motorola somehow got UIQ3 "right" when SE couldn't. SE have UIQ3 "right" now, and because of that Motorola have been able to bring out a first time lucky UIQ3 device (preumably it will be reletively bug free - but we don't know that yet)
Motorola have benefited from not having to develop the UIQ3 platform themselves, so they have been able to concentrate on the hardware. SE are making money off each Motorola UIQ3 sold, meaning they will have more development funds to improve their own hardware, especially now that UIQ3 development is complete
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Posted: 2007-06-06 02:25:40
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Not sure why some of you say the N70 is not stable. My N70 with the first firmware is very stable. That is why I never found the need to upgrade the firmware at all.
Other than hardware capability (like cam, gps, video rec), at this moment my N70 still have more 3rd party software functionalities than my new N95 since many nice apps havent made their way to s60v3 yet.
@max_wedge
You can't be serious that Java multi-tasking is getting close to S60.
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Posted: 2007-06-06 05:54:07
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Put it this way mib, if I can choose from apps that have the same kinds of features as symbian apps, and I can multi-task between them, then I have utility that is starting to approach a smartphone.
Have you even investigated what is available in java apps? Do you even know what's possible with the java platform and the degree of hardware access now possible with JAVA? Or are you operating under the underlying assumptions you formed 2-3 years ago when JAVA was still not much more than a simple game platform?
A smartphone is only as flexible as the availability of applications, and the JAVA platform has exploded with all sorts of applications. For example, using JAVA on my K750 I can browse google maps, view word, excel and pdf docs via the gmail java app, do file management with a range of file managers better than the inbuilt file manager, encrypt files, browse true html websites, manage compressed archives (zip and rar), upload files to ftp servers, edit html documents just to name a few things.
Basically the JAVA platform is now limited by available applications only, of which more and more are becoming available everyday. Even third party media players are starting to come out, though K750 is too slow to utilise them - K800 different story though.
Most thing I use the N70 for I can now do on my K750 (and when I get the K800 I'll be able to do it at qvga screen resolution).
While exlusive smartphone users such as yourself have been looking down your noses at non-smartphone users, believing only a smartphone is suitable for a "power user", you have missed completely the revolution in JAVA. Meanwhile, I stuck with K750 because it had the best camera available for a good 2 years, but instead of crying into my milk about the lack of smartphone os in SE hardscreens, I simply had a look at what's out there and discovered JAVA is not what it used to be.
I tried the N70, and even without it's crashes I still prefer the K750, and given that I can seem to find more useful applications on the java platform, have felt let down by the N70 as an application platform. The multi-tasking is useful, but not as useful as actually being able to do the things I want to do. The only smartphone with better application support than JAVA is PocketPC, which leaves s60 (and UIQ3 for that matter) completely for dead.
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[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2007-06-06 06:44 ]
[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2007-06-06 06:54 ]
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Posted: 2007-06-06 07:42:40
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i agree. k750i is a very very good phone. takes awesome pics (for be a 2-mPixel), has also very good sound (only k-model with mega bass available), i was very pleased when i had mine.
its also common fact that Nokia have really unstable softwares in many of theirs models. (to say something else would be false, just read the reviews).
[ This Message was edited by: plankgatan on 2007-06-06 09:14 ]
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Posted: 2007-06-06 10:12:38
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@Max
You now what Max SE are the best most innovative company in the known world they are class leading in everything they do and they always do right by their customers. Oh yes and black is white as I'm afraid logic and reason seem to of completely escaped you now as i said i will not bother repeating myself again and again and your rebuttals are just pointless you believe what ever you want and I'll do like wise.
Marc
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Nokia E61 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Tom Tom 6, AD-46 with Black Shure EC2g
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-06-06 09:19 ]
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Posted: 2007-06-06 10:16:40
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