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< Esato Forum Index > General discussions > Other manufacturers > The first REAL iPhone Reviews start appearing. Bookmark topic

good to hear that it has REMOVABLE sim card. there seems to be different stories on this floating around the last few days.
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Posted: 2007-06-27 23:04:25
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Yet this review claims:

"But the iPhone has a major drawback: the cellphone network it uses. It only works with AT&T (formerly Cingular), won’t come in models that use Verizon or Sprint and can’t use the digital cards (called SIM cards) that would allow it to run on T-Mobile’s network. So, the phone can be a poor choice unless you are in areas where AT&T’s coverage is good. It does work overseas, but only via an AT&T roaming plan."

http://solution.allthingsd.co[....]reakthrough-handheld-computer/

I won't say much on the device aside from the fact I can't believe there are so many omissions - the fact this is their first device is no excuse, they knew what they were up against. I'm baffled by the overly positive reviews which seem to happily overlook any issues despite the fact they compromise features - they rave about the amazing browser being the first proper browser but the fact it doesn't support java or flash nor works at any speed away from wi-fi doesn't appear to be override the browser.

John
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Posted: 2007-06-28 04:51:10
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Apple can go to hell...... If you buy from itunes you can only use the file in an Ipod??? Bull......

Hey steve Jobs.... Guess what????? I have a 4 GB card in my W810 and it works better than your piece of crap Iphone..........

Ohhh..... As I understand, when the battery goes out, the entire unit needs to be sent to Apple......
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Posted: 2007-06-28 05:34:49
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@johnmcl7:

You say "they rave about the amazing browser being the first proper browser but the fact it doesn't support java or flash nor works at any speed away from wi-fi doesn't appear to be override the browser."

The browser works as fast as it can get the data. If AT&T's network is slow, then that is not a fault of the browser. Firefox displays pages very slowly on a 56k dial-up connection compared to ADSL, do you blame the browser or the network connection?

@REO:

"If you buy from itunes you can only use the file in an Ipod??? Bull......"

Wrong! You can use DRM-free iTunes purchases anywhere, including your W810i, (unlike DRM protected WMA files) and its a easy to convert the protected ones.

I have a 4 GB card in my W810 and it works better than your piece of crap Iphone

You've used an iPhone have you? Great! We look forward to your hands-on review. You're the first person on Esato to be able to compare the iPhone & W810. Hopefully you'll compare the W810's wi-fi, full web browser, hi-res touch-screen user-interface.. oh, hang on - the W810 doesn't have that does it...

[ This Message was edited by: JoolsG4 on 2007-06-28 08:10 ]
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Posted: 2007-06-28 08:56:18
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@JoolsG4
No MMS. Means nothing to me - I never use it. It's got email which is far better.

And what if you want to send photos to people who's phones don't have MMS?

No A2DP. Yes, this is a strange ommision for a music phone. But understandable, as reportedly the iPhone is based on Mac OS X 10.4 which also does not have A2DP support. I think this will be added later, when the OS is updated to be based on Mac OS X 10.5 which does have A2DP.

Just cos it's based on OS X 10.4 doesn't mean they could add one simple feature to allow the use of A2DP. And in fact, it isn't really that similar to OS X 10.4 anyway, so it isn't as though the version severely restricted features (like multitouch etc.).

2MP camera is fine for most general uses, emailing, printing at 6" x 4". Of course there's better, but the pictures just take up more space and unless you're printing poster sized prints the extra size is unnecessary. The flash units on most mobile phones are useless mostly. Best not to have one at all.

Now you're just making excuses. A 2MP camera, without auto-focus, no macro and no flash is pathetic. Face it, there are phones less than $200 which can do more than the iPhone in that department.

Don't forget the lack of flash. And remember, one of the iPhone's features are the photo viewing capabilities. You have to take good photos to view good photos (which means at night as well).

No 3G (your post is wrong, it does have EDGE). For the current US market this doesn't really matter as 3G isn't widely available yet. I can't imagine Apple would dare release an iPhone in Europe without 3G. If they did, it deserves to flop.

Well, sorry about the first mistake, but if the internet is such an important feature for the iPhone, improper data support is not acceptable. Most people rarely use the internet on their phones in comparison with other features like the camera, so being constricted to using wi-fi for any real browsing is not really the best solution for an expensive phone.

No video recording. Something I wouldn't miss. The quality, even on established SE phones is rubbish. Unless Apple hugely improved this I would prefer they leave it out.

Now I have to remind you that just because you don't value video recording, it doesn't mean that no-one else uses it. And despite the relatively low resolution of QCIF videos, it's much better than nothing, and your comment that you'd rather not have it than have it is proof that you're quite biased towards the iPhone.

If someone offered you something, why wouldn't you take it? You don't lose anything by taking it.

On their own, each of these drawbacks are fairly minor.

Umm, camera? What about video recording? Paying for mp3 ringtones

I never said that the phone didn't revolutionise the interface of mobiles, but that's not all. What's the point of a flashy interface if it can't do the basics expected of such an expensive phone.

And the other inevitable downsides of a purely touch based interface means that you can't just use one hand to operate the phone. What blind operation? Can't change tracks when the phone's in your pocket can you? Bet you Apple will charge you more for a headset with controls on the cord (even if there should be hard keys for those functions).

Not that other Apple products don't suffer from similar flaws - i.e. no FM radio in its iPods despite it being industry standard, or no screen on the Shuffles.

This phone is really based on the amount of hype that it's riding on. Not to mention that Apple is supposedly perfect in everything that it does. (Note I'm not anti-Apple - I do use some of their products and I do like their computer range).

Its reviews of the phone are from users from the US. Well we all know that they're basically years behind everyone else. One mentioned that it was a lot easier to use than his old Motorola flip. Well, for the rest of the world, we already know that Motos are near impossible to use anyway.
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Posted: 2007-06-28 09:34:36
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I wouldn't send a 2MP picture to anyone's phone. I'd send it as an attachment to their desktop computer.



What? The OS of the iPhone is completely similar to Mac OS X 10.4 - it's virtually the same with a different UI. Haven't you read anything about the iPhone, or watched Steve Jobs video introduction of it?



Yes, I said there are better cameras. But if you are serious about photography in any way, you wouldn't be using a phone camera would you?



I didn't - I mentioned it and said the flash in most phones is next to useless. My K800 even with a flash can't take decent photos in dim or dark places.



You do realise it is possible to view photos that aren't taken by the phone? Any photos on your computer, taken with any camera, can be transferrred for viewing on the phone.



You seem to be forgetting that this phone is only available in the US, where 3G is not widely available yet. Wi-fi is far more accessible in the US. Apple have already said they will add 3G when it makes sense to do so. Hopefully this means for the European launch. Also, 3G is a huge battery drain.



I know, but these are my personal opinions. When I choose a phone, I consider what I would use, not other people.



I disagree, if it affects the cost of the phone. I've never used the video functions in any of my phones. The quality is too low to be of any use. I've got a digital camera that can record 640x480 @ 30fps or a DV-Camera for full resolution stuff. I wouldn't want to pay more for a feature I'd never use in a phone.



No, it means I believe if a job is worth doing, its worth doing properly. If Apple can add 640x480 @ 25fps recording in a future software update I'll welcome it. But I don't see the point in adding crappy video quality.



Hundreds of thousands of people already pay £2 or more for ringtones. Have you not watched TV or read a magazine lately? Jamster? Crazy frog? Clearly most of the general public don't know how to make their own ringtones otherwise these ringtone sellers wouldn't be in business.

But I agree, not allowing users the option of using their own MP3's is ridiculous, and is clearly a marketing (money-making) decision by Apple.



Basic features like making calls, taking pictures, listening to music, connecting to the internet via Wi-fi or EDGE, sending and recieving email? iPhone doesn't do any of those things does it?



Have you used the iPhone? David Pogue from the NYTimes says "Dialing the iPhone one-handed, though, is easy. As your fingers grasp the iPhone, your thumb is free to tap buttons, scroll lists and so on."



Clearly you haven't read the reviews. The iPhone comes with a headset with a squeeze control on the cord for advancing tracks.

And who says there "should" be hard keys for that? Think 'outside-the-box' for once!

This is what annoys me. People propogating incorrect information about a product they haven't even used, nor even researched properly.



Industry standard FM? When was that announced? Have you ever tried to listen to FM on an MP3 player or phone? The reception is awful (least it is on my K800, W610, K750 etc.) and is unusable if you're actually moving!

The iPod shuffle isn't supposed to have a screen. It was designed that way. Just like Creative have copied the iPod shuffle concept with their Zen Stone player (after publically ridiculing the shuffle on its release!).



You are aware that the Nokia N95 is available in the US? That's a current high-end phone isn't it?
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Posted: 2007-06-28 10:49:03
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People really are quick to slag the iPhone off aren't they? Nobody is saying it is perfect, far from it. Like Jools said this is the FIRST phone ever made by apple, it isn't going to be flawless, but it is a damn good first effort! No phone is going to suit everyone, there are some very simple features missing such as the MP3 use for ringtones etc etc which is dissappointing.

I suggest people actually watch the full keynote speech made by Steve Jobs & to watch the videos on the apple website to fully appreciate the iPhone and the breakthrough features it provides and then come back. Least in the next few days we will be able to see some proper reviews from people who have managed to get one.


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Posted: 2007-06-28 11:12:41
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Whats with the grudges against its purely touch screen interface? Lets not forget this is not the first device like this. iMATE, HTC also have keypad less phones.
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Posted: 2007-06-28 11:22:06
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@JoolsG4
I wouldn't send a 2MP picture to anyone's phone. I'd send it as an attachment to their desktop computer.

MMS resizes the images to appropriate levels for viewing on phones. If I just want to show a friend a picture of say an interesting moment there and then, then obviously MMS is more convenient. Much like comparing SMS to email.

What? The OS of the iPhone is completely similar to Mac OS X 10.4 - it's virtually the same with a different UI. Haven't you read anything about the iPhone, or watched Steve Jobs video introduction of it?

But not so similar that it can't add the function of A2DP. Does the desktop OS X 10.4 have the ability to change orientation of the display with the accelerometer? No. So Apple have changed/added code to the OS, much like what they could have done to support A2DP.

Yes, I said there are better cameras. But if you are serious about photography in any way, you wouldn't be using a phone camera would you?

I know the debate between real vs camera phones, and I still prefer real of course. But using your logic, Apple may as well have put a VGA camera on the iPhone.

I didn't - I mentioned it and said the flash in most phones is next to useless. My K800 even with a flash can't take decent photos in dim or dark places.

But it's better than nothing. It ain't mighty powerful (what do you expect), but for close range portraits etc. it's fine.

You do realise it is possible to view photos that aren't taken by the phone? Any photos on your computer, taken with any camera, can be transferrred for viewing on the phone.

I do know that I'm just saying if this is meant to be so photo focused, shouldn't it have a decent camera? How often do you see people with extensive photo collections on their iPods or mobiles which aren't taken by the phone itself. The majority of photos viewed on phones/devices are the ones taken by the device itself.

Also, 3G is a huge battery drain.

And wi-fi is also a huge battery drain.

I disagree, if it affects the cost of the phone. I've never used the video functions in any of my phones. The quality is too low to be of any use. I've got a digital camera that can record 640x480 @ 30fps or a DV-Camera for full resolution stuff. I wouldn't want to pay more for a feature I'd never use in a phone.

If the W200 can have video recording, then I don't consider it an advanced feature which adds much to the price of the phone.

No, it means I believe if a job is worth doing, its worth doing properly.

I think that contradicts your camera statement.

Basic features like making calls, taking pictures, listening to music, connecting to the internet via Wi-fi or EDGE, sending and recieving email? iPhone doesn't do any of those things does it?

I mean the features like camera, 3G etc. which are generally at a benchmark at this price point.

Quote Start -->

Have you used the iPhone? David Pogue from the NYTimes says "Dialing the iPhone one-handed, though, is easy. As your fingers grasp the iPhone, your thumb is free to tap buttons, scroll lists and so on."

You can call with one hand but not to mention you can't type messages with one hand.

And he also says that:
- You can't operate without the touch of your finger (so no gloves etc.).
- The speakerphone and vibrate are both weak (poor 'basics' of a phone)
- You cannot change simcards.
- No voice memos, or call recording.
- You can't use it as a portable 'hard drive' like the iPod.
- He can't operate the thumboard with two thumbs.

Clearly you haven't read the reviews. The iPhone comes with a headset with a squeeze control on the cord for advancing tracks.

My bad.

Industry standard FM? When was that announced? Have you ever tried to listen to FM on an MP3 player or phone? The reception is awful (least it is on my K800, W610, K750 etc.) and is unusable if you're actually moving!

When people say 'industry standard' they mean the defeacto standard. There's no rule that digital cameras should have 2.5 inch screens, but it just happens to be that they all (most of them) do.

The iPod shuffle isn't supposed to have a screen. It was designed that way. Just like Creative have copied the iPod shuffle concept with their Zen Stone player (after publically ridiculing the shuffle on its release!).

And just because something is designed in a certain way doesn't mean that it is the best way. How is not having a screen convenient? It's the Apple-sheep consumers who bought the shuffle.

There were far better mp3 players out there with mass storage capabilities, usb plug, screens, better battery life, and just as easy to use as the shuffle. They just weren't Apple.

Its reviews of the phone are from users from the US. Well we all know that they're basically years behind everyone else.

You are aware that the Nokia N95 is available in the US? That's a current high-end phone isn't it?

Yet you say that 3G is not widespread throughout the USA. Another contradiction.

I know, but these are my personal opinions. When I choose a phone, I consider what I would use, not other people.

I thought this was an objective discussion on the merits of the iPhone as a mobile phone. Not a mobile phone tailored for you

I'm saying all this as a mobile of this calibre/price, some simple functions should not be sacrificed because Apple made the phone. I'm not doubting that this phone isn't the perfect phone for you, I'm doubting whether this is a product deserves most of the accolades that it gets for being such a technologically advanced device (which Steve Jobs said in the keynote, that the iPhone was the most advanced phone 'ever' to date).

And I don't appreciate the comments that I don't research my facts. Perhaps you should also reconsider your contradicting arguments first.
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Posted: 2007-06-28 12:10:05
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nothing like a good wholesome debate!

got to say the pure lack of features in the iphone and absolutly no innovation gives me the impression that this is just a apple version of the Prada phone.

would be more sensible to have an iPhone vs PradaPhone thread
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Posted: 2007-06-28 12:52:49
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