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Esato Forum Index > General discussions > Other manufacturers > iPhone unlocking will 02. Apple and CPW have to? Bookmark topic

They are not exempt, they are obligated to unlock subsidised handsets that they provide, e.g. all contract/PayG handsets sold on their site or in their stores etc. They are NOT obligated to unlock phones that a member of the public owns, and decides to put a PAYG sim in.

So I buy a phone from Orange, and want an unlock code, can I ask O2, yes, do they have to give me it, NO, will they, probably because I am PAYING for it, mainly to use their service. BUT they COULD say NO, as I didn't buy it subsidised by them.

Same thing applies here, you aren't buying a subsidised handset, you are buying a piece of electronic equipment, that is you're SOLE property, it is not in ANY part subsidised or still owned by the network (unlick all PAYM phones) therefore under the laws they DO NOT have to provide an unlock code.

I suggest they have thought about it, and that is the exact reason why you buy the phone up front then sigh the contract, so they don't have to provide unlock codes, knowing that most people will not exploit the hacks, but will in fact take the contracts that are required.
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Posted: 2007-09-22 21:46:52
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therefore they are by law not allowed to lock it....

as that is monopoly and the CPS doesn't like monopoly...

does this mean all iPhones will be sim-free?

I doubt it!!

the phone how indirect it will be, will be supplied by O2...therefore subject to the same EU wide laws as stated previous in this thread...

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Posted: 2007-09-22 21:54:10
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I understand this topic needs a straightforward answer. I will put the question to our internal dept and see if they have answer.

But I think it lies with Apple on this and not O2, remember Apple could of chose any network they wanted, all networks want the iPhone. I would think that Apple have locked the iphone so the law wouldn't apply as they can't force a manufacturer to free it up for other networks as its their property.

[ This Message was edited by: N3uR0 on 2007-09-22 21:02 ]
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Posted: 2007-09-22 22:01:39
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But on the other hand, that same manufacturer can't force you to use a certain network, that is monopoly, and monopoly is essentially banned.

as batesie said earlier, that's like buying a brand new car, but them only letting you fill it up at texaco....

a car needs petrol to work, very much the same way an iPhone needs a sim to work, if the iPhone comes directly from Apple and O2 don't own it or have any interest in it, there is no way on gods green earth it can be locked.

If we look at this way, why are the tariffs not the same as the SIMplicity plans? they are essentially the same thing if O2 are not supplying the phone...

I feel however that O2 will have some interest in the iPhone no matter how small it maybe. even if it just an O2 logo slapped on the box, that still constitutes an O2 phone, therefore, subject to the same EU laws that govern ALL mobile networks even MVNOs...

I sincerly hope for O2s sake they haven't just copied the US sales model as it will not work over here, we have different laws regarding sales and after sales service...

I, for one will be buying an iPhone from Apple UK and not once will it be used on O2 UK...

by hook or by crook it'll be unlocked....

your parent company should know how the EU rules work, last time I checked Telefonica was a Spanish company, even they are subject to the same laws regarding phone unlocking....

O2 as far as I know, do not have a hope in hell of stopping people getting iPhones unlocked...

"You are the past and the forgotten, we are the internet and the future"

The pirates will win......
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Posted: 2007-09-22 22:19:59
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I'm only talking about the unlock codes not software to unlock the phone. If you unlock it by those means then thats your choice. No need to get shirty. Don't understand why you wouldn't want to use o2 though! but thats because I like the company

And there won't be any branding on the iPhone whatsoever.
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Posted: 2007-09-22 22:33:10
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nono..

I know you're on about O2 unlocking it.. but I think they are going to be forced to allow it.. I know a few people that will happily take O2 to court if thats the only way of making them stand up and listen and follow EU wide laws..

I see it two ways,

a) iPhone comes from Apple directly, non subsidised by O2, therefore HAS to be sim free

or

b) iPhone comes from Apple via O2 to gain a wee sticker, handbook, snazzy bag, this then becomes an O2 handset, and therefore subject to the EU laws stated above...

If either are the correct case but false, i.e. a doesn't come unlocked or b, O2 decide not to play ball, then there will be hell and high water happening in O2 legal dept, I don't care how good your legal eagles are, they will not topple a EU wide law.....



PS.. not getting shirty, just trying to explain the ins and outs of phones, and while I understand you work for O2, I also worked for Orange for 6 years and gained a vast knowledge about phones and services.... not saying I'm better than you, just asking you to see it from a consumer POV and not O2s
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Posted: 2007-09-22 22:42:48
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I'm am interested in what they have to say about this also, will definately seek an answer from the oracle of o2!

Unlucky about working for orange! joking!


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Posted: 2007-09-22 22:49:10
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ahh the oracle of O2.. I was the oracle of Orange!

me unlucky? you only get 50% off line rental, we get free calls and messages and no line rental..

3 however get the best staff deal... free whatever on their phones...



but yeah.. if you can seek an answer from an O2 big wig, that would be grand
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Posted: 2007-09-22 22:55:50
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@N3uR0

Indeed if you can get an answer that would be great, but this has been my point from my first post. It really doesn't matter if Apple have locked it to ensure only 02 Sim cards can be used or if this has been done at 02's request or not it really makes no difference.

The very simple fact is it is not legal to force you to use only one Network on any device that you have bought and paid for, whose fault it is really doesn't matter one of them will be forced to have to unlock it and if they believe different i think hey are both wrong and in for a nasty surprise.

As in all i have read i have seen no one that has tried to claim it is legal to lock an unsubsidised device that a user owns to single Network as that is the whole point of the law to ensure the user has freedom of choice as to which Network he uses the device on and can not be forced to use a particular Network.


I would also like to point out that i am not an 02 hater and if the iPhone had gone to any other Network i would still feel the same and believe the same rule of Law would apply.

Of course i understand why both 02 and Apple want to try and insure this device is used only on 02's Network as if used on another Network 02 receive no income from it and neither do Apple and of course both company's wish to maximise their revenues.

But as i said i think they have failed at looking at the true implications of their actions and just blundered on just believing that because that is what they say must happen that is all that is needed. Again as pointed out by some it is totally illegal to lock a handset at all in some countries what is going to happen in those places then?

Yes i am standing up for consumer rights and that is why i have brought this to everyone's attention. Really 02 and it's resellers should only be selling the iPhone subject to connection to the Network and claiming it is subsidized but as they have not done this that is what makes them vulnerable. But even then at the end of the contract period they would still have to sell an unlock code. I am eager to see what response you get from 02 and just how they are going to try and justify there actions.

May be they will have to adjust there marketing strategy and are fortunate enough to have just over a month before release to do so.


Marc

_________________
Nokia E61, 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Tom Tom 6


Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER

[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-09-23 09:45 ]
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Posted: 2007-09-23 10:42:45
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Staff deal on o2 is 1000 minutes & 1000 texts and free data usage and a free phone for £20 and 15 friends and family 30% discount on online. Aint that bad really.
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Posted: 2007-09-23 14:24:53
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