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I understand your concerns Marc, but the supposed malaise at SE will AFAIK be addressed by products launched later this year, Nokia has always been better at producing flagship smartphones that neither of the other manufacturers even bother to compete with.
The situation is compounded by SE's fixation with seperating the W & K series devices into being great in only one sphere of operation.
Moto and samsung fail to compete in the upper market level also IMO, but that in no way denegrates their excellent mid range line up.
It's just a question of focus really, SE is ticking over nicely in the areas it chooses to compete in.
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Posted: 2007-05-18 13:18:43
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On 2007-05-18 01:13:35, sapporobaby wrote:
On 2007-05-18 01:06:41, enh_cheung wrote:
@sapporobaby
Sorry but i totally disagree ur view.
M600i WAS crap as bad RAM management, un-countable bugs... But it is NOW one of the best phone from the company. If you have a chance to try out the new firmware 9F, you wil know what i am talking about. At least for myself (who have just updated to 9F) are very please with its performance since i bought it, espacially after my recent firmware update.
You could be right my friend but for me, the M600i was a disaster. I could not wait to get rid of it. That phone helped me to switch to Nokia. Glad I did.
U might have you point. After all, I do admit SE is way less attractive than Nokia at the moment...
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Posted: 2007-05-18 13:29:36
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If i re-phrase the thread-starters question, "do SE make GOOD phones" i would answer YES, if the question was "do SE make GREAT phones" i might answer NO!!
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Posted: 2007-05-18 13:36:25
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On 2007-05-18 03:33:21, Dogmann wrote:
@enh_cheung
You are 100% correct it is now some 8-9months later after launch, i had mine after the 2nd firmware and sold it within 2 weeks. You can not seriously expect any one to have to wait months for a device to start working properly.
I accept most devices have a few teething problems and as long as they are addressed quickly that is just about acceptable but the amount of time SE took with the UIQ3 devices plus there lack of communication is why i looked else where and won't buy any freshly launched product from SE again once bitten twice shy.
Not of course forgetting until they start releasing current spec devices they don't stand a chance in hell of getting my money not for old tech anyway. I have to agree with sapporobaby as this is what pushed me to Nokia and eventually the E61 which i have to tell you even with the M600's current status in just in a different class had the M600 given half as good an experience as it i would of been happy and kept the M600.
Marc
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Nokia E61 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Tom Tom 6, AD-46 with Black Shure EC2g
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-05-18 02:37 ]
To be fair, waiting 8-9months after launching for the M600i to be properly stable is definitly too long, I have to say it even I am a fans/supporter of SE.
I remember my first SE phone, T630i. I only get it because the design and function is fairly ok at the time. Then start to love SE because of the nicely manufactured K700i (which I still think is the most beautiful and representitive product of SE). When it comes to the K750i/W800i, I feel SE has lost abit of momentum, I mean the spec was quite attractive and the design are fine, it is just a feeling. Until then, I feel such momentum is keep falling, even the big success of K800i... Up till now, it is kind of at the bottom in my mind and I am, same as many of u, thinking of switching to other brand...
Think back the path i took, I only buy SE's product because it is good and reliable and I like it. If they fail to give me that impression and feeling, then I could or should leave SE and seek for something else that would give the that impression again.
Talking about E61, it really is a good phone and I was thinking it against M600i when i renew my contract. The only reason why I choose M600i at last, apart from the fact that I am a fans of SE, is the pricing. I got my M600i as a free phone with a 18 months contract for £15 per month, which I dont think posible with a E61.
After all, I dont hate or dislike my M600i at all as i still think it is a good fone, dispite the fact of taking 8 months to get it right. But if SE continue to operate in this way, I have already got my next target and will switch to them with no doubt.
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Posted: 2007-05-18 13:51:08
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SE are currently broadening their market. They have some excellent phones out at the moment, just because they are not beating Nokia doesn't mean they are failing. Nokia has a huge advance, and has done for years. SE are now trying to increase their middle range offering to appeal to a broader market. This is a smart move, and in a year or two the fruits of that (cash flow) will start to show in high end products that compete with Nokia pound for pound.
A couple of years ago, all the Nokia fans delighted in telling us SE users that SE didn't have as broad an offering as Nokia and therefore SE was poo. At the time though, SE phones (the few they had) spec'd higher than compatible Nokia's. They had more punch per handset. Look at T610, or K700 for example. Even P910 was good though it had to hold the market segment for way too long so by the end was long in the tooth.
But the point is that SE can't both maintain market leading high end phones AND increase marketshare in the mid range (where the consumers are) at the same time. So they had to make a sacrifice somewhere. Hence, P990 comes out without proper development, multimedia phones lag behind Nokia (only since N73 and later), and UIQ3 hardscreen project is on hold. But in business manufacturers work on 5 year plans. The fact that SE don't have a commitment to the high end at this very moment, is not because they have dropped the ball. It's a purposeful strategy to concentrate on the consumer segment to build market share and cash flow.
Then they will start to hit out with the good.
P1 to me is a sign that SE or on the make (if you see it as the M600 upgrade that it is and not the P990 replacement). I know it still has deficiencies (no wifi for example), but it's getting there.
The other aspect often complained about SE is their lack of EDGE support. This is a bitch for US market sure, but again it's a matter of prioritising your markets. SE know where their bread is buttered (Europe). They will commit to EDGE more if and when it becomes obvious that 3G will not fully supplant EDGE. Personally I think EDGE can only last as a common network technology another 5 years at most, whereas 3G will extend beyond that. 3G is faster, it's that simple. SE would be better off extending their HSDPA footprint than their EDGE footprint at this moment.
Yes it's a shame for US market if you happen to be an SE fan. But there are no shortage of great phones available in the US market from other players. Slowly as SE increase the consumer marketshare, they will start to branch out more into the US. (w810 and K790 are examples of SE starting to aim at the US market)
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Posted: 2007-05-18 15:52:35
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Why isn't the SO903i classed as a good phone?
Its got 47hrs music listening time, GPS, 4GB Pro DUO and 2GB Mini-SD slots.
At least SE competes in the Japanese market the most advanced on the globe, not like Nokia which truly and squarely had its butt kicked all over the show when it tried to break in there. It didn't make so much as a ripple.
The same thing happened to Nokia in South Korea - I think it sold 2 phones altogether and one of those was returned.
I can't believe people are tearing SE to shreds just because the N95 has appeared. I'd rather SE took their time and got it right first time than announce handsets just to keep up with the Jones'.
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Posted: 2007-05-18 16:06:16
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@mweb6161
You did not understand my comment concerning myopia. To simply dismiss a technology because someone feels that it is not needed is in the least a short-sighted view. This could mean that one does not understand the technology or can not afford the technology and the simple thing to say is that they do not need it. To dismiss HSDPA or GPS is truly a short view on technology. What we see now will be driving what we are using later. If that makes me inhospitable then it just does. However your continued digs, and snipes about Nokia fanboys and Nokia lovers makes you sound like a whiner simply because someone rightfully finds fault with SE and decided to go to a product that meets their needs.
You asked me for data to back up my claims. I did. You suddenly went quiet. What does that say about you? The bottom line is this. I was an SE man through and through, but the moment they decided they do not want to support me, or started to sell completely inferior products (M600i), I bailed and went to Nokia. My current experience has been great. E61 and the N95. Sure they have problems but nothing compared to what I had with SE.
I hope that I have made this very clear for you.
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Posted: 2007-05-18 16:57:55
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Talking about E61, it really is a good phone and I was thinking it against M600i when i renew my contract. The only reason why I choose M600i at last, apart from the fact that I am a fans of SE, is the pricing. I got my M600i as a free phone with a 18 months contract for £15 per month, which I dont think posible with a E61.
After all, I dont hate or dislike my M600i at all as i still think it is a good fone, dispite the fact of taking 8 months to get it right. But if SE continue to operate in this way, I have already got my next target and will switch to them with no doubt.
I still think the M600i looks great and I will take your word that it functions now, but as I said, 8 or 9 months is too long to wait for a good phone. The E61 filled the void out of the box and has been great ever since. If you are happy with the M600i and SE, then stay with them. As we say in America, "Fool me once, shame on you", "fool me twice, uh....... can't get fooled again". No wait that was Bush. The saying is: "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me."
you get my point.
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Posted: 2007-05-18 17:02:13
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On 2007-05-18 16:06:16, goldenface wrote:
I can't believe people are tearing SE to shreds just because the N95 has appeared. I'd rather SE took their time and got it right first time than announce handsets just to keep up with the Jones'.
Good point dude,
But SE as well as Nokia have a less than six month, conception to birth cycle. There is no way, you nor I, nor anyone else would wait the year that it takes to get a phone out the door.
Go look over at the k800i thread. Still going strong with upgrade talk all over the place. Finally that phone is getting fixed. It was the last phone, along with the M60i that I owned (Bobafett bought it). I was tempted to buy the new k610i ( I think it is the k610i. It is the thin silver phone). Very nice looking.
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Posted: 2007-05-18 17:06:29
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On 2007-05-18 15:52:35, max_wedge wrote:
SE are currently broadening their market. They have some excellent phones out at the moment, just because they are not beating Nokia doesn't mean they are failing. Nokia has a huge advance, and has done for years. SE are now trying to increase their middle range offering to appeal to a broader market. This is a smart move, and in a year or two the fruits of that (cash flow) will start to show in high end products that compete with Nokia pound for pound.
yada, yada, yada. Hey MAX!!!!!!!!!!!
Long time. How's it hangin?
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Posted: 2007-05-18 17:10:45
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