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your right personal experience count for a lot. my own personal experience is more in line with the which survey still doesnt stop me buying se nokia or whoever
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Posted: 2005-09-09 15:53:31
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yep, and everyone has a different experience. I personally think the networks are as much to blame for phones not working properly, and user error also plays a part.
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Posted: 2005-09-09 17:22:41
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I'd put user error fairly high on the list of causes... If you could see how some unknowledgeable people treated their phones...
This message was posted from a Nokia
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Posted: 2005-09-09 17:35:04
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exactly. Some people would say that's the ui's fault, however there is only so much stupidity the interface can allow for.
Example of user stupidity - receiving a faxed photocopy of a floppy disk from a customer when we asked them to send us "a copy of your floppy disk backup".
This is the same sort of thoughtlessness that the phone interface has to protect itself from!
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Posted: 2005-09-10 04:15:29
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@max_wedge:
I think these surveys give us some perspectives into what is happening. You cannot expect these surveys to cover every possible angle.
For Which? magazine survey, we have agreed that this survey gave reliability based on user reported faults (of any kind and not just handsets). We did the right thing by not generalizing the Which survey to a "manufacturer handsets/hardware" reliability.
Connect magazine survey covers only 38 models of handsets out of possible hundreds from many manufacturers. Based on the results you CAN say SE is as reliable as Nokia ONLY for those handsets that were surveyed. You cannot generalized this statement (which I think you are trying to do
). Otherwise, you can throw out all your points in the other "SE ranks poorly.." thread.
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Posted: 2005-09-10 05:40:15
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I'm not actually relying on either survey. I believe SE handsets are reliable, based on my own experience and that of many friends and associates.
However I accept both survey's general findings, but don't accept that either are entitled to claim to have fully exposed the problems.
I posted this thread a little tongue in cheek, I admit
because I thought it fair to show another interpretation, not necessarily because I think it is more right than the which survey. (Mib, you generalised the which survey to SE with your thread title,
) And from what I understand the Connect survey is reader reported faults also, so I'm guessing that the 38 models of phone is the total number of different model phones recorded by all participants of the survey. Models reported in statistically irrelevant numbers may have been exluded form the figure of 38.
Once I gave my handset to a friend and he deleted two video clips I'd taken because he kept pressing "delete" to try and get to the next clip. WTF? The button said "delete", is that not good enough for someone to avoid deleting stuff accidently? I'm careful now who I hand my phone to, but I'm not gonna jump on the kick SE bandwagon just because the interface didn't prevent the loss of my video footage. At some point users have to accept their inadequacies and move on.
Likewise with the software issue. Sure it's a pain if you are unlucky and have to update your phone a day after buying it, but SE is by no means alone in this. It hapens to many brands of phone. The fact that the phone can be repaired with software and doesn't need a lengthy wait for a replacement, means to me that the phone is more reliable than one for which you need to wait for a replacement. Especially when the update has turned the phone into a virtual linux server - it never crashes (in my case, a K750 crashing on the first day of ownership, fixed with a SEUS update to R1L). In all my experience with SE phones it's the only time I've had to "repair" an SE phone.
That to me is reliability.
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Posted: 2005-09-10 07:36:45
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max_wedge:
Quote:I believe SE handsets are reliable, based on my own experience and that of many friends and associates.
You know your (and my) experience dont have any significance in any statistics. We are dealing with averages and variances here (i.e. some data will be fall outside the bell curve). Like I told scotsboyuk, the statistics is valid only within the premise of the data that was collected. If the data collected is "general" in nature then the statistics show performance in generality (or vice versa). Once you try to change the premise, the statistics is no longer valid.
btw: I (plus my family/friends) have used many Nokia phones (mostly smartphones) and some Samsung and I/we did not need to "repair" them in any way (not even a phone reset). Does this count as excellent reliability? Well, I wont go as far as that.
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Posted: 2005-09-10 10:47:20
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Well, in Norway several of the largest store chains are now refusing to sell nokia phones because of to many problems with quality.
The second largest mobile seller Expert pulished its repair statisticks to a consumer television show called FBI
According to their repairstatisticks every third sold Nokia phone comes back for repair which is a significantly larger fault share than any other mobile brand.
In a number of Expert stores during a specific period there were sold 20.250 nokia units, and 11.406 units of Siemens, Sony Ericsson and Motorola.
Of those 20.250 sold nokia units, 7.330 were returned for repair within 6 months.
Of the 11.406 sold units from other brands only a total of 1.047 units were returned for repair in the same 6 months period.
Several other major mobile dealers in norway confirm these problems.
I have absolutely no use for stupid surveys like the which survey that basically says nothing concrete about faults and repairs, but are only based on user opinions and includes operator/network errors.
I like numbers, real numbers, and just like I have experienced from our own servicecentre, the numbers speak their own clear language.
[ This Message was edited by: numb on 2005-09-10 13:57 ]
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Posted: 2005-09-10 14:38:58
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@numb:
Could you provide some links to some websites which may have carried this piece of news? This should be significant news since the biggest stores in Noway refused to sell Nokia because reliability problem.
btw: if you google the Which? survey, many links are found (i.e. many sites carried the news).
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Posted: 2005-09-10 16:29:19
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It was broadcasted in Norwegian television, in the consumershow called FBI and mentioned in Norwegian and atleast one Danish newspapers (something called Jyllandsposten).
I havent searched for websites with this info
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Posted: 2005-09-10 16:57:06
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