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> Why no HDD smartphone?
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Come on guys. Keep up!
Toshiba recently announced their newest stamp-size 4gb HDD's. They will hit the market soon and is aimed at mobile-phones and other small portable devices.
Todays microdrives at 4 Gb comes in the size of Compact Flash wich would not be a problem for a smartphone.
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Posted: 2004-07-16 13:12:20
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Yeah i was gonna say that toshiba thing. I read that somewhere yesterday!
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Posted: 2004-07-16 13:17:09
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Ok, so how much do these Toshiba HDD cost? Have they been tested for shock reliability? What kind of interface do they use? Are controller boards available already? What are their power requirements vs solid state mem? And even at their claimed 0.7" platter profile, that's still larger than the chips on solid state mem cards. Remember that the "sub 1-inch" claim doesn't include the casing, or the removeable slot (since I'm sure people would complain if the drive wasn't removeable and user upgradeable) How THICK would this drive be once manufactured? It may be HALF of IBM's microdrive, but if it's just as fat, it'll still add volume to the already
fat-@$$ P910.
My point is, the reason why we don't have HDD smartphones NOW is because existing tech doesn't allow it. Sure, prototypes have been shown... plans have been announced... that's all BS until they're actually on the market.
If they released a HDD based phone, using the new Toshiba HDD, and sold the phone at US$2500. Would you buy it? Even if it ran out of power in half a day?
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Posted: 2004-07-16 13:34:28
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Yeah i agree but my question i repeat it once again is... Which way do you think it will go in the future? HDD or cards? Or is there a third alternative.
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Posted: 2004-07-16 13:40:29
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Of course the P900 is big. But the K700 would maybe be 1 cm longer with at stampsize HDD and no one would complain.
And the battery. Well my 4 Gb Muvo gives 14 hours of playback on one charge. Maybe you would only get 5-6 hours on a phone but you can charge your phone every night and the problem is gone.
The shock-resistance would be smaller for sure but I have dropped my Muvo2 with HDD more times than my K700 or T610 for that matter and it stil operates perfectly. It even has a big crack in the display because a friend of mine dropped her ashtray on it. No problem.
And with Toshibas new drives we ARE going to see phones with HDD's!!
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Posted: 2004-07-16 14:18:57
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So how long do you think it will take for the first HDD phones to appear? I wonder who would be the first to launch it!
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Posted: 2004-07-16 14:46:10
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Toshiba will start producing the drive this autumn. So I guess that the mobile phone manufactors needs at least 6 months of testing it.
Maybe 9 months or a year from now.
Here is a link about the worlds smallest HDD.
http://sdd.toshiba.com/main.a[....]0008e3000000010000659c00001d2a
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Posted: 2004-07-16 14:51:49
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I think cards will be the future, they are getting smaller and cheaper. The PRO system will take up 32Gig! imagine that in your phone all at the size of the Duo Pro! so one day we will be there. They also use less battery.
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Posted: 2004-07-16 14:54:56
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@ trentors thanks a million for that link!
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Posted: 2004-07-16 14:55:28
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whizkid, well.. it all depends on cost, size & reliability.
re: dropping your Muvo... have you dropped OFTEN it while it was playing? Or while it was off? HDD have a 100x shock capability when parked. And how is access time from the time the disk parks or goes to sleep?
Remember, that your phone is contantly accessing info while it's on (when an incoming call comes in, it has to access your phonebook and look up the name & number...not to mention custom ringtone & photo.
All these things come into play when choosing storage types. Remember that ideally, we'd all be running RAMdisks, not HDD. The only reason we run HDD on our PCs is that they are cheaper/GB. Another thing to consider is that HDD slow down when full, solid state doesn't. HDD would be neat if they didn't have the size penalty vs solid state... but they do. No matter how small... remember, a HDD doesn't work without a controller and other hardware requirements. (Some of which can be solid state mem to act as RAM... so you get a double size penalty on the board)
You can't just glue the HDD on the existing boards and they magically work... controller chips, power supplies, RAM, and other things must go along with it... thus increasing platform size. solid state memory however plugs straight into the same RAM bus that the phone already has and needs. The K700 with a HDD won't just be 1cm longer, it will be at LEAST 1" longer (Toshiba's HDD is about 0.9"), or 1/2" thicker to accomodate the additional circuitry. Not to mention increased battery requirements, increasing the thickness by at least another 1/4" or 1/8".
Take note... solid state memory is actually paper thin, and about 1/8" x 1/8" ... the only thing that makes it big as it is, is the casing, and contact terminal requirements. (Same goes for CPUs, which as very tiny... only the routing of the pins, and the case, make the chip as large as it is)
Size-wise... the new HDD of Toshiba (and I'm sure IBM will show something as small as well soon during CES) may be under 1", but how will you mount it to the phone? Glue it? Screw it? Will it be removable? If so, then a slot must be made, and manufacturing something like that will incur additional size constraints due to the minimum thickness that the plastic casing can be cut/moulded to retain rigidity. Your 0.9" drive will occupy about 1.25"x1.5"x0.5" if users want it removable.
This is fine for MP3 players with no other function... or PDAs that are fairly larger than the largest celfones out now. But I personally wouldn't want our mobile phones to go back to the old 80's size. The P800 is quite enough as it is... I would want it to get THINNER, not fatter.
If using the new HDD will allow manufacturers to make a P910 type phone, and flatten it to UNDER 1" in thickness... then I say go for the HDD. If not... no thanks. The P800/900/910 should be the LARGEST than mobile phones get. Otherwise, I think we're all moving in the wrong direction... we'll end up with laptops (like Toshiba's Libretto) with GSM/EDGE/3G PC cards! Because that's seems to be what you guys are asking for since most of you don't seem to mind the additional size.
I even find PPCs too big to lug around outside of work. I don't want my mobile phone to ever get that big.
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Posted: 2004-07-16 15:02:55
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