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I agree SE should take heed of the issues with P990. I'm not arguing about that. But I say again, if you think Nokia are guilt free you are just as bad a Nokia fanboy as you claim of anyone who dares defend SE
I used the N70 as an example of a phone that could do with further firmware improvement but which was dropped by Nokia after less than 2 years. Same as P990. Okay P990 is a worse example I admit.
Btw, I'm not dissing the N70. I do actually like the phone (apart from the UI which I just don't like). But it's a solid phone, with good spec level (for it's day), and stylish.
But a quick google and it's obvious I'm not the only one who has problems with N70 crashing. I've also seen posts about N70 with the same problems mine has.
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Posted: 2008-03-18 05:51:52
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hi have a small problem with my SE i have an unlocked white n gold edition SE w850i origionally on vodafone i'm on 3 network and this being some features are restricted due to the fact that it's not a 3 phone can anybody help me brand it as a 3 phone or something where i can use the phone to the full potential i'd apreciate any help thnx ppl
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Posted: 2008-03-18 06:12:09
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@23RB, you'll have to post your question on the W850 thread, as you may have noticed this is the P990 & SE bashing and bitching thread
@max_wedge, I don't intend to become a fan boy for any brand. If I ever was one, I probably supported SE until my P990 experience. I totally agree that if we look around we'll see technical problems with every brand out there. It's SE's attitude that brings them several notches down from the others. Nokia's name keeps coming up because they are SE's major competitor in the smart phone category. I'm really waiting to see Nokia's touch screen device, that will be the true comparison between these two companies and we will see where each one stands.
I still believe that the P990 design is way better than anything currently on the market and the build quality is much better than Nokia, although SE has serious QC issues. The problem is SE's decision to abandon P990 and totally ignore its customers. Most P990 owners were die hard SE fans and probably had previous experience with the former P series. The fact is, SE could have corrected the problem but decided not to because they just didn't care.
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Posted: 2008-03-18 10:53:32
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@Max
The N70 was alreday old when the P990 was launched as it runs S60 2nd Edition not even 3rd Edition now if Nokia stopped firmware after 2 years that is still twice as long as SE supported the P990 for which was under one year. Also after SE released what they considered the last Firmware that introuduced 3 new bugs it took a huge protest from users to even get one final firmware to fix the newly introuduced bugs that SE claimed was a final and stable firmware. Now if you take that attitude into account it is hardly surprising so many are seriously disappointed at SE's attitude and behaviour and makes it very easy to understand thier anger.
Also how ever bad you think the N95 was on release it's only problem was Multitasking it didn't constantly restart in the middle of calls or any of the wonderful things the P990 did to display "Your devcie has restarted to improve performance" Still the most absurd thing i have ever seen any manufacturer put on devcie they know is not stable to explain why your devcie just crashed as it means they knew this was going to happen yet still saw fit to release the device and contrary to what everyone thought they weren't able to fix it quickly with firmware upgrades either.
As for upgrading software with the N95 well despite what you think no technical know how is required neither is hunting for the upgrade program either as it is included in the PC Suite and says quite simply update phone software it really couldn't be easier. I even believe that now it informs you when newer firmware is available to.
As i have said no one in there right mind would try and claim Nokia are perfect and make no mistakes, but what we do claim is that Nokia at least do something about them and release far more firmware and much quicker and it tends to fix things without constantly introducing more bugs each time it fixes one unlike SE. Yet again when we are talking about SE and how they treat their users what relevance does what any other manufacturer have and it doesn't is the answer. Two wrongs don't make a right it is no comfort that another manufacturer does wrong if i bought an SE or intended to buy an SE only how they behave concerns me the rest is totally irrelevant.
You accuse many others of being Nokia Fan boys as thier motive for attacking SE how about we attack SE quite simply because they deserve it? Your never ending defence of the indefensible and support and justification for SE is without foundation and whilst you like to claim you are not an SE Fan Boy or biased that's not what it looks like to those you are happy to accuse of being Nokia Fan Boys. Don't do as i do do as i say springs to mind.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Tom Tom 6
Dogmanns Nokia E90 Blog @
http://dogmann.vox.com/
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-03-18 10:38 ]
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Posted: 2008-03-18 11:35:05
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On 2008-03-18 10:53:32, makbil wrote:
@23RB, you'll have to post your question on the W850 thread, as you may have noticed this is the P990 & SE bashing and bitching thread
@max_wedge, I don't intend to become a fan boy for any brand. If I ever was one, I probably supported SE until my P990 experience. I totally agree that if we look around we'll see technical problems with every brand out there. It's SE's attitude that brings them several notches down from the others. Nokia's name keeps coming up because they are SE's major competitor in the smart phone category. I'm really waiting to see Nokia's touch screen device, that will be the true comparison between these two companies and we will see where each one stands.
I still believe that the P990 design is way better than anything currently on the market and the build quality is much better than Nokia, although SE has serious QC issues. The problem is SE's decision to abandon P990 and totally ignore its customers. Most P990 owners were die hard SE fans and probably had previous experience with the former P series. The fact is, SE could have corrected the problem but decided not to because they just didn't care.
I second that.
Apple still dishes out firmware updates to its consumers...Nokia exchanged thousands of faulty batteries for new ones for free in India.But SE didn't even bother to give more firmware updates and issued a comment to hundreds of pleading P990 users in the SE dev thread that the phone is perfect and if you are not satisfied,buy a P1i.
Just because of the faulty P990 and the attitude SE showed us,my next phone(or ever) will be least likely from SE porfolio.
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Posted: 2008-03-18 11:36:26
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This is what I meant as payback for SE's treatment of the P990 case:
http://www.sonyericsson.com/c[....]inancialsannouncement-20080319
It seems people may be taking notice of what is being said about their products.
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Posted: 2008-03-19 11:43:13
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still going on about this?
I think its quite clear. Simply move to nokia. Or choose another brand. Case closed.
[ This Message was edited by: soane28 on 2008-03-19 11:01 ]
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Posted: 2008-03-19 12:00:33
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All handset OEMs are likely to take a hit this year - not just SE......
Handset outlook
".....As a result, he has sliced nearly 7 percent off his estimate for Nokia's first-quarter revenues and lowered his annual revenue target to US$85.2 billion, down from an earlier forecast of US$88.2 billion, though that's still up 7.5 percent from 2007 in constant dollars. Windsor also has lowered his revenue estimates for struggling Motorola and Swedish-Japanese joint venture Sony Ericsson. "All players are likely to take a hit as a result of a lower overall market that has suddenly become unusually soft at the high end," Windsor said in a research note."
source
Not because a small percentage of smartphone users (the P990i holds a very small smartphone market share) had problems with their P990i I'm afraid.
The P990i debacle is woeful but to claim this is the reason the SE might take a hit this year, when other manufacturers look likely to do the same, sounds to me like wishful thinking.
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Posted: 2008-03-19 12:02:43
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Hi Makbil
I would imagine myself and few others are less surprised at this then some, but IMO the absence of HSDPA in any SE smart phone still. Plus only the Xperia announced so far that has it is not going down well with those that need or want a top spec smart phone add to that the lack of real answers from SE and no apparent change in attitude from SE and it's hardly surprising IMO.
@Goldenface
I think the above mentioned factors also has a lot to do with it and whilst it may not be down to just the unhappy P990 users. How they were treated is no secret and people are also unhappy with far more than just there smart phones. The K850 had a much worse reception then previous K series devcies and disappionted many with it's release and problems and how long the took to start being fixed. Now if this is market wide downturn or not we will just have to wait and see what the other manufacturers report to know.
@soane28
If you don't like what many of us say don't read it and if your happy with SE's offerings and how they treat you good for you. But obviously many of us still don't feel the same way and from the above statement it appears to be affecting their bottom line now so maybe this will make them wake up and change although some how i doubt it.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Tom Tom 6
Dogmanns Nokia E90 Blog @
http://dogmann.vox.com/
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-03-21 14:46 ]
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Posted: 2008-03-19 12:11:02
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@soane28, in law there is a concept called "punitive damages", that is what I'm applying to SE at the moment. I am still using my P990, I've learned to live with it but it is very unlikely that my next device will be from SE.
Just moving on to some other device will mean I have to swallow an enormous sum of money SE stole from me - "stole" is the right word here since the specs published do not match the actual features. So my choice is to keep using the P990 and at the same time try to hurt SE's image as much as I can as payback.
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Posted: 2008-03-19 15:11:31
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