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I've also never liked the flip and could see no point to it. I also recall all the posts we had where people were asking where the setting is to enable opening the flip to answer calls, which is about all it would have been good for IMHO
erm, Danny Baldwins off of Coronation Street, Had this feature!!
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Posted: 2007-08-23 10:51:13
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On 2007-08-23 10:37:00, myth® wrote:
You seem to be amazed by your p1i which is fine with me,
Not at all, I don't even have a P1 - but I know the form factor from the M600, which I do own, and that's how I know it's excellent.
How can a rocker qwerty be better than a full qwerty ??
By providing larger, easier to hit keys in a narrower, easier to reach format. We're talking thumb-boards here, on both the P1 and the P990, and for thumbs the ergonomics of the P1 are far superior.
The discussion of such an obvious matter is nothing but a waste of time and bandwidth.
Only for the blinkered...
I've been trying to use a friends M600 for a few days, just out of curiousity.
Trust me, I would have become insane and my friend would have got it back in more than one piece, if I would have used it for another few days...
Do you think that SE would have released the P1 at all if the M600 was really so unusable? Of course it requires a little practice, as does any new form of keypad - for the first few days I couldn't get past seeing it as a normal T9-touting phone number-pad, and my thumbs were continually in the wrong place as a result - but once I got over that hump it became the most comfortable, fastest input method I've ever found on a phone.
Whether you like it or not, the flip is a unique and excellent invention of SE,
Like the rocker keyboard then
which, along with the ts, has always been one of the main reasons why 'real' p-series users have preferred it. and this since day one.
Let's just get one thing straight, despite my current foray into M-series territory I'm as "real" a P-series user as they get. I carried a P800 for no less than 2 years, and I had a P910 for another year after that, I loved them both and would defend their design to the death. I know Jot like the back of my hand, and on those UIQ2 phones I completely accept that the flip was a unique and 100% necessary innovation that was essential to the success of those models, and their usability.
But that was then, this is now. UIQ3 is
different. UIQ3 does not need the flip, and with SE's brilliant new innovation it doesn't need two different keypads, either.
SE may of course further develop and release rocker phones in the future as well, and they will surely do, as long as there is a demand (and it obviously is), but they should move it back to M or start a fresh series and name it R, Q or whatever...
"R" for Rocker, in the same way as "P" stands for Flip, right? Or as wrong as the rest of your post?
[ This Message was edited by: Boinng on 2007-08-23 10:18 ]
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Posted: 2007-08-23 11:14:14
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P obviously stands for "Phlip" xD
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Posted: 2007-08-23 11:23:30
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@Boinng
Who said that P stands for flip ?
Of course it does not..
If you mean my post with 'P = Flip' a few posts back, it means that the flip is a must have for a p-series.
Congrats on R for Rocker, you're a genius
As for the rest of your post, yes, I really think that it'd be a waste...
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Posted: 2007-08-23 11:41:54
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@Boinng, while I respect your view on the ergonomics of the M600/P1 (because they are your personal opinion) why do you have such a hard time accepting the views of others who do prefer the flip and the P990 style keyboard? Along with a great number of people, obviously I find it easier to use that keyboard and the flip and nothing you say will convince me otherwise.
You need to understand that this is not a matter of one being better than other. I may have smaller fingers therefore the P990 keyboard may be very easy for me to use whereas you may have large fingers so you just can't use that keyboard. So, one is better for you without the flip and the other is better for me with the flip, there is no point trying to convince the other side that you are right, because you are not.
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Posted: 2007-08-23 11:55:07
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@boinng
Right. You love this design - that's great.
I don't - it's ok too!
I've tried P1 and it's disaster in compare to P990 - just for my PERSONAL taste.
In fact - did you ever see a computer with semi qwerty?? And guess why not??
Anyways, I get your point and aknowledge P1 as a great device.
Just not for me and many other Pusers (And for many others it's great!). It's always like that, with any decice.
But please - don't compare FC mode with one hand operation on P1. You can like it, but it's not even near! Typing text is different, and also navigating!
Do please, just love your phone beeing a bit more objective at the same time. I've also used other Pseries...
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Posted: 2007-08-23 12:06:51
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Yeah Boing, what will you do when the true successor of the P990 comes, WITH A FLIP, will you jump a bridge??? chill man...SE can make smartphones with the 2 types of design, and there people that like one or another, or both
For me, Makbil, and others, the flip design is just superior...this is an example why:
http://www.allaboutsymbian.co[....]pt_using_UIQ3_one_handedly.php
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Posted: 2007-08-23 12:08:38
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Makbil, in terms of ergonomics one thing certainly can be objectively better than the other - since most of us have a broadly comparable selection of eight fingers and two thumbs it's not all as subjective as you suggest. Is a full size PC keyboard easier for you type on than the P990 or the P1? Of course it is, and for me too, and for anyone else with two hands - that's not a subjective judgment, just fact. In the same way, I believe the P1's keyboard is easier, and more comfortable to type on than the P990's - not just for me, but for anyone. I believe it's a better design, and I believe that's why SE are obviously championing it in their latest flagship smartphone. The only impediment people may find to using it is their own prejudice, and preconception....
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Posted: 2007-08-23 12:15:54
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On 2007-08-23 12:08:38, ares wrote:
Yeah Boing, what will you do when the true successor of the P990 comes, WITH A FLIP, will you jump a bridge???
The successor to the P990 is already here, without a flip, and called the P1. If you're talking about whatever comes next, then yes it may well come with a flip, but I don't believe it will be the return to tradition you're imagining. I think the choice of design for the P1 is proof that SE have recognised the need to rethink the old P series concept. I predict that we've seen the death of "flip closed mode" for example, and this successor will be more like a P1 with a choice of keypads, still using fullscreen UIQ3 whether the flip is up, down, or removed.
http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/features/item/Proof_of_concept_using_UIQ3_one_handedly.php
That whole article is outdated and ridiculous, and based on an obviously limited knowledge of UIQ3 in the P990, not in the M600 and P1 where one-handed use is entirely native. Try to demonstrate this "Proof of concept" to anyone using any of the four flipless UIQ3 phones released on the market so far, and they'll fall about laughing!
[ This Message was edited by: Boinng on 2007-08-23 11:30 ]
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Posted: 2007-08-23 12:28:20
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@Boinng
Sorry buy you really need to start adding IMO to some of these statements you seem so happy to state as facts. For instance i missed the P800 as just couldn't stand the colour and styling as for me it looked horrible and like a toy but that was just MO.
As for the P900 and then P910 as soon as i go both of those devices i removed the flip, i have never used the handwriting recognition either.
For me a P series phone with the Flip removed was my preference and it appears to have been quite a few other peoples also. As i think in MO a flip less P series just looked so much nicer with just the screen visible. It is actually one of the things that turned me off the P990 even before it was launched as it had a qwerty stuck below the screen that i was never going to use.
My preferred method of data input was always the pop up on screen keyboard as i was incredibly fast and accurate with this method. Some of these things you are claiming may well be your preference and suit how you like to use the device. But it is rather arrogant and insulting to the rest of us to suggest your way is the best and only way. I don't dispute that for you and your use that is what you prefer but can see no evidence to back up your opinion that it has to be for anyone else. Even if we all choose the same device not all of us will use it it the same way as that is down to each users personal preference and freedom of choice.
I really fail to understand what the big deal in this whole thread is now as it seems to be going round in circles and getting no where fast. We should all just be able to accept that their really is no best method to do anything only what each of us likes to do and how we like to use it counts. I'm very unlikely to suddenly have a Eureka moment and decide after all this time was usage was wrong and i should start looking at how to use Jot Pro as my data entry method and it appears a lot of others also feel this way.
If and when SE release a P9 series styled device with a flip and if i chose it based on it's looks and spec's the first thing i would do is still remove the flip. Does that mean i shouldn't be allowed to own and use one? Many here now love the style of the M600 and P1 and find the keyboard excellent and fast to use personally i don't fall into this group but that doesn't make it bad or wrong just not my preference.
I also can't agree with this statement of yours that the semi qwerty is the best input method ever, maybe for you it is but again this does not make it a fact merely your preference and opinion. I really didn't Ike the semi qwerty on my M600 and actually found it a pain but it wasn't a problem as i preferred on the on screen keyboard any way. Now for me currently the best Data entry method is a full qwerty and is why i love my E61 the best. i even prefer to the full qwerty that is on the E90 and why i sold it. But just because this what suits me best and my usage doesn't mean it has t be for anyone else.
Marc
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Nokia E61, 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Shure EC2g
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-08-23 11:44 ]
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Posted: 2007-08-23 12:44:35
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