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I agree partly mib. But that seems to indicate SE should adopt WM, not s60

And yes WM is more versatile in many respects than UIQ3, but then so is it more versatile than s60.

Most of the business customers I have who purchased phones with qwerty keyboard come to see the qwerty as a gimmick and find themselves using the TS for text input. Especially for those who prefer to write, handwriting recognition is only possible on a TS (though handwriting users are a small group of users I admit). And TS is not only about text input. The other aspect of TS is the added flexibility in navigation. It's very similar to a mouse in terms of functionality.

I also agree about the faster implementation of non-smart phones, or even non-ts smartphones, which is why I would like to see SE move ahead on development of a hardscreen UIQ3 device. AS to using s60 for that, I don't think it would be practical for them to remtain uiq3 for ts, but useanother os for hardscreen.


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Posted: 2007-05-16 05:27:38
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@max_wedge:



You forgot one thing. S60 is not competing directly with WM but UIQ3 is.



Not entire true. I use opera with my N95 and I can easily assign short cut keys like page-up/down/change window. I find it more chores to use Pocket IE on a TS. And I can't do it comfortably (using TS) when I am sitting in my couch/chair as both my hands need to be away from armrests.



I think it is a bit too late for SE to do that now as it has spend a bundle on acquirng UIQ3. Unless SE can pull a rabbit out of a hat, it will very hard to gain significant ground using UIQ3. Worse thing that can happen is when SE does come out with a hardscreen UIQ3, it will be as buggy as P990 was. (well first generation is always problematic).



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Posted: 2007-05-16 08:32:34
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@mib - some good points - not to mention a too-small touchscreen and crowded, link-heavy websites... Try manaeouvering quickly along esato's last 24 hrs posts on a treo without opening new windows by accident!!!
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Posted: 2007-05-16 08:43:43
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I don't agree. I find the xda mini with 5 way controller gives you the best of both worlds. I would like to see an SE P1 like device, with 5 way controller instead of qwerty (TS qwerty or even better handwriting recognition is my preference) (and wifi of course!)

Plus more room for screen space.



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[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2007-05-16 08:32 ]
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Posted: 2007-05-16 09:31:13
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...yeah, but you don't fully disagree either, mr. Wedge my comment was about a more specific "what if" - the treo 750v is an example of getting it wrong! Looks great on paper, and a great software wasted... They reckoned, we have a touchscreen, so screw the keypad...let's make it really rubbish! Oh, AND lets make the screen too small to enjoy all the great software!!! The xda, methinks, has a bigger screen?! My treo example was just a warning re. what happens when all the lovely on-paper-specs don't coexist well!!! The treo really makes you shed a tear - great software, speedy processor, and all in a rubbish body...
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Posted: 2007-05-16 09:43:14
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yes, but we are talking about SE maintaining a TS (I think it's a rather big call to claim that SE's TS market is unimportant) so s60 is out. Hence the only options are UIQ3 or WM.


that's why I am still hoping SE will drop qwerty in favour of 5 way controller (or even a slide format UIQ3 with qwerty on slide and 5 way on front)
But one thing you forget, a TS phone still has other inputs, you are not limited to TS input. Mostly the only difference in key input is for texting, and here I agree that for T9 use, a traditional 3x4 keypad is superior. Aka why I think SE should release a hardscreen smartphone, to cater to T9 those who prefer T9 input.


You paint a poor picture of the UIQ3 experience, but as SE get stronger in the market they will be able to get new OS versions to market more efficiently. I see it as an overall market strategy which they may see as taking a further 2-3 years or so before they are competitive with Nokia on hardscreen smartphones. I predict P1 will have far less teething problems than P990, and eventual UIQ3 hardscreen will also benefit from the P990 "experiment".

My N70 is a bug fest (I have the latest firmware), really I've never seen anything like it in an SE phone other than P990. So SE aren't the only one's with first gen model firmware problems. It seems a problem endemic to mobile phone manufaturing.


[/quote]
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Posted: 2007-05-16 09:50:10
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max_wedge:



I was right on the spot with P990. You can search for my posts before P990 was released and see what I said then that didnt come true about p990. I wish I can be less pessimistic but all I can see is SE having a lot of issues with UIQ3. The P1 is still using Symbian 9.1 whereas the rest are already on v9.2 and moving to 9.3. Hardware specs P1 retains the M600. There are still no sign of hardscreen UIQ3 which can only mean it is delayed.




I have the N70 with original firmware and it is as stable as a rock (except speed may be slow). I think you are over-exagerating when you say N70 is a bugfest. Maybe you want to name some bugs . imo, N70 is way more stable than any SE smartphones ever.


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Posted: 2007-05-16 10:20:44
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hey check-out the latest blue prints of the k900 at mobile-review.com its gonna be great it resembles a lot like the LG 5 mp phone this 2 has a 5 mega pixel camera with a Xenon flash and its sooooooooooooooooo gonna rock the shoes of the N95 & N82 dont know wen its gonna be announced though hope its soon:)
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Posted: 2007-05-16 13:56:22
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I do not think those blue prints are for real. We all saw pictures of Sofia earlier on and they where accompanied by spy pics of the P1 (Esato news archive, 13 March 2007). Which makes it even more credible to me that Sofia will look nothing like what is shown in the blue prints.

P.S.: It will be ugly (yet somehow I don't seem to care)
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[ This Message was edited by: Delta 9 on 2007-05-16 13:09 ]
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Posted: 2007-05-16 14:07:36
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Hi all,

Firstly while i accept that for some users a Touchscreen is of primary importance some of the things being stated are just not right. I can scroll and click faster with my E61 and previously my N93 than i could with my M600. I can also navigate and enter text far quicker on my E61 than i could on the touchscreen equipped M600.

If you are happy with a touchscreen stick with it but stop inventing deficiencies in non touchscreen devices that simply don't exist. If you want a touchscreen device fine but remember you get a poorer quality screen that suffers from visibility problems in bright lighting conditions so there is a trade off in having a touchscreen and no device is perfect for every one only what is right for you .

Also some need to realise that although the N95 is a smart phone it is a Multimedia focused device not an outright business device although add a SU-8W bluetooth keyboard and large amounts of Data entry is no longer a problem. But on everything else the spec of the N95 is untouchable by any SE device currently available, processor , graphics, HSDPA, WiFi g, camera, screen are all of a higher spec. You may not like it and if so don't buy it but all these comparisons are getting really tedious.

As for a non touchscreen UIQ3 device there is very shortly going to be such a device just not from SE but from the only other company to so far decide to use UIQ3 Motorola which has a great spec just a shame IMO it is black and lime green plastic.


As for comparing the still not announced 5mega pixel K800 upgrade you really can't compare a camera equipped device with the N82 smart phone that will also have Xenon flash and to say one is better than the other as neither are yet realeased is ridiculous. As you are merely hoping this will be the case you can't possibly know, as up to now the main advantage has been the Xenon flash for low light situations and Nokia are not standing still in improving their camera performance either so you will just have to wait and see when SE release theirs which is better at least Nokia have announced theirs for release Q3/Q4 whilst SE's is still nothing more than a rumour.

Marc

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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-05-16 15:33 ]
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Posted: 2007-05-16 16:30:13
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